My Big Shed layout


Schematics

Trinityjayone

The layout/block diagram was taken from Train Contoller
I designed the BDL168 and DS64 as symbols in the drawing program I use - DELTACAD -
Pasted the layout into deltacad
inserted the DS64 and BLD168 symbols into drawing
and drew lots of lines till it made sense to me!!!!

cmaceeepc
Craig
 
Trinityjayone

TrinityJayOne said:
Haha, well as long as it makes sense to you then that's ok!
Click to expand...

Yes it looks like spaghetti but with DeltaCad you are able to view in layers so when I drew it each BDL168 wiring was done seperately so when "layered" you only see eg BDL168 "103" and its cabelling
See Detail of "103"
BlockDetection-wiring2-103detail.jpg


This way it takes away the confusion of the spaghetti and allows you to work to specifics, It helps that I was an Electrician in a previous period but 25 years on does dull the skills so this is welcome as a learning experience.

Also as this is a work in progress please comment - I need all the advice I can get :D :D :D :D

cmaceeepc
Craig
 
Locnetbuffer-USB - Frustration

Well after having my layout computer have a hissy fit and having to reload XP, I then had to reload (well try 12 times) Locobuffer-USB drivers, I finally was able to get the locobuffer port loaded.

What should have been a simple plug and play scenario turned out to take over 3 nights (2 hours each and a couple searching for answers at work) to fix.
I had downloaded the unistaller - removed drivers (4 times) till finally after I dont remenmber how many resarts it finally followed the manuals steps.

Damned frustrating when RRC says just plug it in - hah

Anyway now connected - JRMI and TrainContoller now connecting

Now back to testing/learning what to do


cmaceeepc
Craig
 
Well this weekend I revamped my test track, 2main with forward and reverse cross overs.
Wired up the BDL168 (6 blocks detected) and DS64 to control 4 turnouts.

Next tried to program the attached units, now didnt I have fun!!!!,
Went through process to program BDL168 and DS64 and after several hours of trying each both would not accept new ID - damn damn damn
Read each manual that many times I think I could recite them verbatum.
I got a spare DS64 pluged in Loconet and power, check with JMRI that it was connected and went through setup - press STAT button for 8-10 secs till light pulse changes - press switch on DCS50 - key new ID - press closed - and hey presto it accepted the new ID.
I went inside got a coffee and a smoke and thought what went wrong with the others- eventually realised that was with the "common" connected that they would not accept ID.
Disconnected common went through steps and both took new ID.
Summary is that in either manual there is no mention of not having the common connected prior to programming.
Next fired up Train Controller - drew up the new test track - set up all blocks and IDs, set up all turnouts and ID's - setup loco - set basic route and off the train went

Wow after the hours spent trying to fix what turned out to be a simple fix it was great to at least get a loco to go where it was supposed to go -

Next will be to set stop and braking points so I can simulate eg a station etc

I will admit that whilst I never read the instructions properly first up and when I do they still are so ambiguous that left = right and right = left at the same time, no wonder we are all turning grey

Anyway

cmaceeepc
Craig
 
Sounds like you got it working in the end, good stuff. Now where's the video? :D

Also, can you go into some details on how the detection works? Is it voltages over a block of track, or optical sensors perhaps? Some other method?
 
TrinityJayOne

You dont want a video of me ranting about it not working the way I "thought".
Whilst the manuals are very sparse with pertinant info - the stuff I needed to know - I got most of my answers from searching forums etc.

The BDL168 very simply works on current monitoring (correct me if my decription is wrong) - If there is current draw in the block (loco or carriage with resistor wheelset or lights) the block indicates to the system (and via plug in LED card) that the block is occupied - the system will then follow the rules set if occupied (train stop - train brake etc)

What I cant work out is how to get the loco to stop at a designated point
How is the length of the block measured - I have changed the braking and stopping lengths in TrainContoller but I seem to be missing something:confused:

Do I have to put another block in at the end of line and or if I want it to stop at a station do I have to have a block change at the stop point ????????

I think its something simple - probably why I cant find out why

Please help if you know what to do


cmaceeepc
Craig
 
Again went trolling through the web, read the manual again and I believe the issue is the speed profile of the test loco.
It appears that train controller uses this to calculate the distances needed to brake and stop.

I will endeavour to profile the test loco and see how this goes.


cmaceeepc
Craig
 
Hi Craig!
You are correct that all locos must be profiled for you to use them in automatic. (Also, if you want them to auto stop in correct position while using schedules in manual and are auto switched to a passing track or have a stop signal during a train meet.)

When you go to the selected engine's properties, click the Speed tab.
Now click: "Adjust Speed Steps:
The first thing needed is to do a general calibration of the selected engine using three different speeds. This calibration is close and will get you near the markers you have set.
For more accuracy, you now must perform the "Advanced Fine Tuning". This is very tedious and time consuming, but necessary if you want the marker numbers to be accurate. The "marker" numbers you use is in inches and will be near correct after this adjustment.
USE HELP and the MANUAL for these adjustments.

I have a few locos that I used the fine tuning, but most have been profiled using only the first calibration. I then do a hit and miss by adjusting the markers until I am satisfied...doesn't take long;).

Keep in mind that your train load, track voltage, and engine performance will affect these settings (Also, acceleration and deceleration settings.). Each engine/train must be adjusted. Many of my markers are custom set for the individual engine/trains to compensate for the these variables :)
 
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RexHea

Thanks for your reply - Its hard to ask silly questions of someone who has done all this before without seeming silly.

I will profile my test loco asap and will respond.

Your reply has confirmed what I suspected but aprehensive about doing it but will now give it a go

lets see what happens

cmaceeepc
Craig
 
Man, nothing silly about trying to learn. Block detection and signal control are not difficult but very complex by themselves...now add TrainControler and you really do have brain strain LOL:). I have no idea how many times I had to read the TC manual before the bell went off and I understood what the "H" they were talking about on just ONE thing:D.

I'll try to help where I can and if I can't maybe we can figure it out together. This area of MR is a hobby by itself and I have been doing other layout work for awhile now, i.e. lots of cobwebs that need to be cleared in my "older" brain. :eek::D
 
Frustrated but Determined

Well with throwing my back out and setting up locos for Train Controller, its been very frustrating.
I have followed suggestions posted above and while I know I am close to it doing what it is supposed to do i.e. go from one block and stop in the next block.
At the moment it goes from the start block and stops in the third block. Now I am trying to understand why it does that and not in the block itis supposed to stop.
I am thinking that it requires position indicators to tell it is at a stop or brake point. TC is supposed to calculate based on simplified speed profile when to stop or brake. What confuses me is that currently, whilst it is doing it in the third block, the loco does brake and stop in about six inches into the third block.
Do I have to split the second block to have it stop at a designated point either a station or before entering a turnout?
On the positve I can set a schedule(route) and send the loco to all blocks but as per previous without stop indication is will not stop at endpoints and perform shuttle or reversing operations.

If I cant get TC to calculate these I am looking at either reed or IR contact points to indicate these points

I am determined to make this work before I convert the Big Shed Layout, I know it will work and I will make it work.

For all the Aussies reading have a great Australia Day


cmaceeepc
Craig
 
Craig, you don't need to use any external detection to have your train stop where you want it. Give me a few minutes to fire up the computer on the layout and I will get back to you on this. :)
 
OK, I'm back. Some of the terminology is a bit confusing but maybe my definitions can help.

While in "block editor", there are three settings you have to setup for the stop.

Distance (white/clear box): the distance after entering the block that the train will travel before the brake marker setting (Ramp) take effect (after block detection trigger).

Ramp (yellow arrow): The braking, ramping down, distance your train will travel after entering the Brake marker setting (after the Distance setting). After this length, the train will be moving at threshold speed that has been adjusted during your engine profile.

Stop Marker (red triangle): Located at the end of the braking distance setting and stopping the train. (This is selected and inserted from the yellow dot selection column located above the Marker Settings.)

An example of settings for a passenger siding:
Distance: 10
Ramp: 105
Stop: 122
With this setting, the train will start to slow after traveling 10" into the block. The ramped down braking will take place over 105" and slow to a threshold speed (very slow) for 17" and stop. These are only examples and each block will be different for your use. To begin, I believe they recommend that the settings for distance and Ramp add up to equal the "Stop" marker setting. However, in my example, I wanted the passenger train to travel a bit further at very slow speed (threshold) at the train depot, so I set my stop a bit farther than the total.

Be sure and set "Head of train" in the provided box. This way your settings are based on where the engine is. Also and for now, concentrate on just getting close. There are many different markers and gizmos that can be added later, if you have the need and are more comfortable with these options.


NOTE:
The illustrated lines/arrows/etc. are slide-able for you convenience, but only the numbers make a difference in length.
 
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Rexhea

Thanks for all the info

It appears that Train Controller Bronze does not have this facility.

I am hoping that my contact with Railroad & Co will give some insights into why or how you are supposed to be able to do what would be the most basic of functions.

I hope I will not have to go to the added expense of upgrading to Silver version - the boss is starting to watch my $$

Your description of what to do is exactly what my mind was telling me - to me calculating a point based just on speed settings is very inaccurate - I tried pretty much the whole long weekend here in Australia -
Bronze it appears would need to use indicators to tell it a loco is at a certain point to work correctly - more dollars -

The saga continues

cmaceeepc
Craig
 
Well after the frustrating weekend I had, I went into the shed to run it just one more time and it decided to stop in the block - "what the":confused::confused:

Oh this is going to be so much fun!!!!!

Whilst at it I tried a "shuttle" run and it worked to:confused:

This without any changes except the computer went on standby overnight????

I will dwell on this some more


cmaceeepc
Craig
 
Sorry to be so late getting back to'ya!
Sounds like the layout spirits are trying to help you, LOL:D.
I have the Gold (only because of upgrade deals), but thought all three versions of RRC had the block editor. While the software is in edit mode, double click the block symbol/rectangle on your layout drawing and the edit window should come up showing a red rectangle. That not there???

If you do contact RRCo., they will respond quickly with help. Also, there is very good and very helpful forum that you can join. Go to the RR&Co. web page for the link. Please keep me informed, as you have my curiosity going.:)
 
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