Kitbash Long Shark BP20, and a B-unit for DL-109

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beiland

Well-Known Member
Kitbash Long Shark BP-20, and a B-unit for DL-109

I've mentioned these two projects in several postings scattered throughout the forum, but I thought I would bring them together in one single subject thread,...and particularly since I intend to utilize the same chassis for both projects.


Two Projects Utilizing
Proto 1K, DL-109 Locomotive frame/chassis




1) Creating a 'B-unit' or DL-110 for the SantaFe

DL109,DL110.jpg

There were several roads that had B-units for their DL-109 locomotives. I've chosen to model the Santa Fe one. I had to make a choice where I would cut the two shells such as to end up with a proper window placement, and a reasonable duplication in the roof details. I need to finish the diaphram on the one end and the coupler mount.

Then it needs to be painted and decals added.





2) Creating a 'plastic model' of the PRR, BP-20 Shark

BP-20 photo, ps.jpg

I've always wanted one of these extra-long Sharks that PRR had...only ? of them as far as I know. So likely you will never see them modeled in plastic in a production manner.

The few attempts to provide a model for this BP20 never had a chassis of the proper wheel base. I've chosen the Proto DL 109 chassis. It has the proper trucks, and it has great weight and running qualities....even good speaker locations for a sound version. Had to do a bit of filing to get the shells to fit over the nose.
 
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beiland

Well-Known Member
DL109/110 Project

Lets take this one up first since it is the easiest. Basically I had to get two DL109 shells so I could cut the front off of one and replace it with the tail of the other.

I did not desire to do horizontal cutting, nor individual roof segmenting, so I had to make a choice as to where to make the single cut and still preserve the closest possible spacing of the side windows. Here is my project so far.

B-unit DL109.jpg
DSCF0645.jpg
DSCF0642.jpg

Naturally this new 'b-unit' fits right onto the stock chassis. So both units will have power, and perhaps DCC and sound.

With the stock weight of these engines, the combination of the two should pull the walls down !!
 
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beiland

Well-Known Member
Now I need to add a few more details including the door diaphragm, then paint and decal it. ...any good painting volunteers as I'm not well practiced :)

DSCF0646.jpg
DSCF0647.jpg
 
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beiland

Well-Known Member
Looks good so far. I hope you can hide the splice joint.

I took a LOT of care when I was cutting the shells to get them as 'square' as possible. And I cut them both just a wee bit long so I could then fine sand them down to as perfect a fit as I could get. It took time but I got a really good joint. It may be hard to tell that because of the two distinct colorings on the two shell pieces. I'm hoping a good painter can tell me how much 'filler' I need to add to the joint.

I was also being careful about the joints of the side body panels.

DSCF0643.jpg
DSCF0644.jpg
 
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CNR Glen

Member
Now I need to add a few more details including the door diaphragm, then paint and decal it. ...any good painting volunteers as I'm not well practiced

If you are painting it to match the Santa Fe A unit it looks like a pretty easy paint job. Just match the silver/stainless steel and use decals to stripe it. I could do it, assuming there's a decent match for the silver out there. The only problem is the existing paint on the larger part. To get a good paint job without 'ghosting' the shell should have been stripped before.

The splice looks good in the closeup.
 

beiland

Well-Known Member
The only problem is the existing paint on the larger part. To get a good paint job without 'ghosting' the shell should have been stripped before.
So I should have stripped that larger shell BEFORE I did the joining. I kind of hoped that if that was necessary it could be done afterwards.

I wonder what might be the best 'paint stripper' for stock Proto 1K paint jobs??
 

beiland

Well-Known Member
PRR BP20 Kitbash

I determined that the 3 axle truck frames on the DL109 model chassis were the same as on the BP20, and that the nose of that chassis would fit up into the plastic shell of a normal PRR Shark without a lot of excess trimming (but some would be required).

I also determined that the wheel base of the BP20 was a little longer than the DL109. At the model size it works out to be a little less than 1/2 inches additional length needed. This nice robust cast metal frame of the stock DL109 needed to be extended a little less than 1/2 inch.

I've found what I think to be the perfect solution,....a 1/2 inch piece of square steel tubing at Home Depot. Two pieces of 'square tube' inserted between the two sections, either side of the cut frame, should act nice and firmly to rejoin the frame at that slightly longer length. At first I was worried about the loss of a certain dimension from just the width of the saw blade used to cut the frame in half. But now that I see the dimension needed in the final frame as a bit less than 1/2 inch, I believe things will work out using a normal hack-saw blade that will remove some extra metal for the full 1/2 spacer tube to fill and make a frame slight less than 1/2 inch longer.

I had to do some filing (quite a bit actually) on the cast metal frame to get reliefs I need to fit the 'Model Power' Shark shells to fit. So I've done that filing, and put together a 'temporary' demonstration BP20 shell to fit it. Here are some pics. I have not cut the frame and extended it yet, but I did make the 'drive shaft extension' I would need.

DSCF0322.jpg
DSCF0323.jpg
DSCF0324.jpg
DSCF0325.jpg
 
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beiland

Well-Known Member
I've seen in the past several references to resin shells or cast metal shells of the BP-20 model being offered as 'kits'. In most cases I think theses shells were to be placed onto Athearn chassis. But I never saw where they were extending the chassis wheel bases to match the proper size. I even remember some kits being sold on Ebay that were obviously mounted on too-short of a wheel base chassis....just looked strange.

If anyone cares to they might bring up some of these kit histories to analyze. Were there any really good shells out there?? I might consider them. I think I have a really good chassis.
 
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CNR Glen

Member
There are many stripping chemicals out there, from brake fluid (smelly), oven cleaner (worse) and a few others. I switched to using 97% isopropyl alcohol. No nasty smell and it will eventually stip the paint. I just hope it won't attack your splice joint glue.
 

NH Mike

CEO & Wheel Cleaner
Great work on both projects. About all I can suggest would be to add some backing to the splices on the insides of the shells where they won't interfere with the chassis or any of the motor and drive parts. Some strips of 1/4" wide .020" x 1/2" or so long styrene. In all forms of construction a butt joint is the weakest. Be a shame to have one pop loose from handling after all the paint and decals were finished.
 

beiland

Well-Known Member
Great work on both projects. About all I can suggest would be to add some backing to the splices on the insides of the shells where they won't interfere with the chassis or any of the motor and drive parts. Some strips of 1/4" wide .020" x 1/2" or so long styrene. In all forms of construction a butt joint is the weakest. Be a shame to have one pop loose from handling after all the paint and decals were finished.
Roger that, thanks :cool:
 

beiland

Well-Known Member
Paint Stripping

There are many stripping chemicals out there, from brake fluid (smelly), oven cleaner (worse) and a few others. I switched to using 97% isopropyl alcohol. No nasty smell and it will eventually stip the paint. I just hope it won't attack your splice joint glue.
I know I have in the past looked up info on a lot of these different stripping ideas/products, but only experimented with a few.

I seem to remember that it can also depend on the pain that individual manufacturers utilized. Perhaps I will try to google the Proto 1000 particular case and see what I come up with, or submit a individual question on some of the forums to get actual case history experiments.
 

beiland

Well-Known Member
Longer Nose on BP20

Here's something I never realized, the nose on the BP20 was longer than on the normal Shark....WOW. Sure enough I got out my scale dwg of the BP20 and compared it with one of the a shark shells I had....the nose is longer.

View attachment 35380

I was contacted just recently by a gentleman that was involved with one of those aftermarket kit shells for the BP20, who informed me of this fact. I've invited him to enter our conversation and contribute his knowledge. I hope he does so.
 
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pat_lawless

New Member
BP-20 chassis

Hi All! I'm the person mentioned by Brian who was involved in the resin kit of the BP-20. The company I worked for(and was a part owner of) was called Miracle Castings, and was based in Brantford, Ontario, Canada. Our kit used a resin chassis as its basis, which was designed to take the trucks and motor from an Athearn blue box Alco PA to power it. I've attached a photo of the A-unit assembled and painted. We also made a B unit of this locomotive.

There was also a kit offered by a company called Trainstuff LLC, which was located in the U.S. We had no connection with this company, which I believe was located in Massachusetts. I'm pretty sure they also offered a resin model of the DL-109. Trainstuff's Shark model can be distinguished from ours by its too-short nose, which was exactly the same size as a 4-axle shark. I only recently got a look at a set of their models, and they had a vary basic level of detail. As far as I know they haven't been available for a long time.

I still have the masters and molds for our shark models, and I've been hoping to produce a limited number for sale. Currently I'm battling with major health issues, but I expect I may get to this in the next 3 months or so, so I'll let people know if I manage to get some made for sale. Regards,

Pat Lawless
 

beiland

Well-Known Member
Hi All! I'm the person mentioned by Brian who was involved in the resin kit of the BP-20.

I still have the masters and molds for our shark models, and I've been hoping to produce a limited number for sale. Currently I'm battling with major health issues, but I expect I may get to this in the next 3 months or so, so I'll let people know if I manage to get some made for sale. Regards,

Pat Lawless
I'd be interested in one of those shells Pat.

BTW, I just recently picked up a brass dummy B-unit at a train show in Balt. It has a bit of a decal problem on one side, and I'm trying to sort that out now.
http://www.modelrailroadforums.com/forum/showthread.php?p=304323#post304323

Here is my B-unit, ...an Alco import
 

beiland

Well-Known Member
Castrol Super Clean

I know I have in the past looked up info on a lot of these different stripping ideas/products, but only experimented with a few.

I seem to remember that it can also depend on the pain that individual manufacturers utilized. Perhaps I will try to google the Proto 1000 particular case and see what I come up with, or submit a individual question on some of the forums to get actual case history experiments.
WOW, look what I just found earlier today
Castrol Super Clean
 

beiland

Well-Known Member
Miracle Casting, PRR site

Hi All! I'm the person mentioned by Brian who was involved in the resin kit of the BP-20. The company I worked for(and was a part owner of) was called Miracle Castings, and was based in Brantford, Ontario, Canada. Our kit used a resin chassis as its basis, which was designed to take the trucks and motor from an Athearn blue box Alco PA to power it. I've attached a photo of the A-unit assembled and painted. We also made a B unit of this locomotive.
Pat Lawless
I was searching around the internet for 'Miracle Castings' and ran across this PRR site:

The Pennsylvania Railroad Technical & Historical Society, Discussion Web
http://prrthsdiscussionweb30239.yuku.com/topic/904/HO-scale-BP20-s#.UUiCpDfDtnA

Some interesting discussion, but I'm not sure how to enter that discussion.

...and here is Pat Lawless's wikipedia page:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:SHKANGLE.JPG
 
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