Buildings and Structures; Built-Up VS. Kits?

[Trucklover]

Hi Guys,

Im wondering if you all can help me out. I recently sold most of my buildings off, they were all Walthers Cornerstone Buildings in HO scale. I mainly did this because im going into the prototype modeling, modeling real structures, currently my plans are for an area along the BNSF mainline in La Midara, CA.

Anyways, what do you guys prefer to do? Do you prefer to buy your buildings and structures as kits? Or would you rather pay a little extra and buy them fully assembled, painted, and weathered, all ready to be placed on your layouts?

I would like to hear what everyone thinks. I had an idea thrown my way, not just by one member, but by a couple in the past, that i should consider buying kits, assembling, painting, and weathering them and selling them. Custom building/kitbashing kits into a structure that would suite your needs would also be an option.

Im just curious if there would be a demand for such a thing. Right now, im out of work, and have been out of work for about a year now, and like many, im having a hard time getting a job ANYWHERE, so something like this might be an easy way to pay the bills for a little while, at least until i can get a job.... Not to mention, i think i would enjoy building structures for re-sale, and it would definitely keep me busy.

Good idea? I wanna know what you guys have to say about this, and what you would prefer, kits or Built-Up's.....

 

[Trucklover]

Now for some other information i have been thinking about regarding this:

1. I would do services for both HO and N scales in the building, painting, and weathering of structures. I would prefer to do Walthers Cornerstone Series Structures, but others could also be done if someone would like something done and gives me the specifics on which building from which manufacturer.

2. I was thinking that i can have some generic Walthers Kits that i would buy, both in N and HO scale, build them stock, paint them, weather them and then list them along with pictures...

3. Another option would be to combine kits in kitbashing, either with 2 of the same buildings to make them larger, or by combining 2 buildings to make one. I wouldnt be building to any standards, just making a building that looks somewhat appealing and might be of some use for someone on there layouts

4. Custom Building would also be an option for anyone. If someone has a space that needs to be filled by an industry, weather they have an industry in mind, or they would like to have something custom built for fill in the space, i could also do this, again completely building, painting and weathering the structure so its ready to put on a layout....

 

[Cjcrescent]

In the area and era I'm modeling, wood buildings are the majority of the structures. There aren't any wood buildings for that that are built up. Besides I prefer to build 'em myself thank you.

Unless I happen to get super arthritic hands in the next day or so, there will be no built ups.

 

[Selector]

I don't mind a couple of built-ups if they are nicely done and can fit the bill...so to speak. For example, the "machine shop" that Walthers has as a built-up is a nice model, and when properly painted up is a nice stand-in for something erected from scratch. Same for their indexed turntable...a gem in the HO world. I have "Kathy's Cottage" (I think is the name) because I didn't particularly want to erect a house.

I do appreciate that many modellers do just that....they "model", and they are serious and persistent...and consistent...about their preferences and practices. I still marvel at all they accomplish. For me, I just want to play trains on something passable as a layout that lets me suspend disbelief. For me, there is a "good enough" place where I don't mind building some, even one craftsman kit so far, and then purchasing the few that I feel will help out.

My next project will be the Danby Sawmill by Keystone, after which I intend to build some scratched stripwood structures and weather them.

-Crandell

 

[Larry]

When you go to a lot of train shows you see people trying to sell buildings that they have assembled & weathered & they hardly ever sell one. The reason is they have to ask way to much to make any money. The cost of the kit, weathering & your time makes the model unsellable. Most people like myself would rather build their own kits or scratchbuild their own buildings. It's the satisfaction of knowing "I" put it together & if theirs mistakes I learn from them. I use to never scratchbuild anything until I got on this forum, then I started seeing what everyone else was doing & now I have 30% of my own buildings on my layout.

 

[dmeephd]

Built ups? Not!

Besides not letting my sisters date musicians, here is a list of other things that I won't do:

Build benchwork; I'm an electrical engineer, not a carpenter - I buy my benchwork prefabbed from Sievers and assemble it.

Water down my Scotch; I like it neat and preferably single malt.

Buy built up structures; I prefer, no insist, on building my own. I buy kits, sometimes building as the directions, many times kit-bashing. I also scratch build those prototype buildings that I admire for which no kit exists.

Turn my steaks into cinder blocks; I like them medium rare.

Make my own trees; there's too damn many of them to make and life is too short.

However, Trucklover, I've admired your dioramas and wish you well in your endeavors in selling built-ups. I suspect that there's a market for it, as Walthers, Busch, Noch, and others are offering them. (Hey, some modelers might hate building structures as much as I detest carpentry!)

David

 

[sparkyftw]

I think if it looked great, price was good, and I had the money, I think I would buy a prebuilt if it was like a scratch build. I think it would be cool to "trade" industries and stuff around, be part of multiple layouts.

But as said, the price is too steep.

 

[RexHea]

Sorry, I am one that prefers assembling structure kits. Unlike rolling stock, there is not only more challenge, but also more room for personalizing.

 

[mdcustom]

Josh there is a market for custom builders, however it is not in HO and N scale. Ninety percent of the custombuilders work in O scale for the simple reason that is where the clients are who are willing to spend what it takes to have someone professionally assemble structures. In the past year I have only had 2 HO pieces, 3 S scale pieces and 189 O scale pieces. which should give you an idea as to where potential clients are. I spent 9 years building up a client base working part time as a custom builder to allow me to quit my "regular job" and work full time as a custom builder, which I have been doing for the past three years. While I do build a kit from time to time for clients, nearly all my work is scratch usually from photos only though at times the buildings are still there and I can get a measured drawing.

I know one custom builder who recently told me he no longer does kits, he was building FSM kits for $500-600 plus the cost of the kit and figured out that he was making less then $2 an hour what with assembly and painting all of the details. And at that price most of his clients had a hard time understanding why it cost so much.

One of the things that you will have to look at is how long it takes you to assemble, weather and detail a structure. Then what are you going to ask a client for that service? If a Walthers kit retails for $40 about the most you could get would be $80 for assembly. At that you would have to build it, paint it, weather it and add details in less that 4-5 hours for it to be worth it. Is that practical for you? And do you think you could sell that kit for $120 to someone?

If you would like more information on custom building you can get hold of me off forum and I will try to help mdcustommodels@arkansas.net

Matt Dillow
MD Custom Models

 

[DirtyD79]

Personally I prefer building and painting myself because it gives me a chance to weather and detail them to my taste. Granted I would still buy a prebuilt version if it was a particular model I liked or had a need for.

 

[jbaakko]

Wow Josh, looks like you found a forum of fierce kit builders here! I'm sure there's a market, you just need to find it!

 

[dmeephd]

O Scale Buildings?

Josh there is a market for custom builders, however it is not in HO and N scale. Ninety percent of the custombuilders work in O scale for the simple reason that is where the clients are who are willing to spend what it takes to have someone professionally assemble structures. In the past year I have only had 2 HO pieces, 3 S scale pieces and 189 O scale pieces. which should give you an idea as to where potential clients are. I spent 9 years building up a client base working part time as a custom builder to allow me to quit my "regular job" and work full time as a custom builder, which I have been doing for the past three years. While I do build a kit from time to time for clients, nearly all my work is scratch usually from photos only though at times the buildings are still there and I can get a measured drawing.

Hi Matt!

I would have never guessed that there would be such a demand for custom or built-up O scale buildings, but after reflection I guess that the dearth of available kits might be a contributory factor.

I understand that there are complete layout builders that get pretty large commissions for providing - I would hazard to guess - well-heeled customers with complete, ready-to-run layouts. Just out of curiosity, are any of these turn-key layout providers also clients of structure builders such as yourself?

David

 

[NYW&B]

In response to the question, I would point out that traditionally HO (and perhaps to a somewhat lesser extent, N) model railroading has been a craftsman's hobby, not one based on purchasing ready-builts. Most hobbyists get great enjoyment, satisfaction and have pride in what they have built themselves. Simply put, ready-builts mainly appeal to the hobby's talentless and the "dabbler" element.

Likewise, even those who are looking to buy built-up structures generally want custom built models of their favorite prototype, not just some generic kitbash. As pointed out up-stream, building such specific models is highly time consuming and big money has to be charged to make it worthwhile. Thus, the pool of clients is typically rather small.

That said, I have seen some kitbashes sell on eBay for reasonable figures but these weren't run-of-the-mill models, they were well detailed and nicely weathered examples. If you really want to test the waters in this area, I'd suggest kitbashing a relatively large factory building (Walthers or Atlas), heavily detailing it so that it appears truly unique and with moderate weathering. Put it up on eBay with a starting figure of say $100 and see where it goes.

NYW&B

 

[NYW&B]

I understand that there are complete layout builders that get pretty large commissions for providing - I would hazard to guess - well-heeled customers with complete, ready-to-run layouts.

David

In fact, this is usually a very well-heeled clientele. Typically, a 4x8 professionally built layout is in the $12k-$15k range, and only slightly larger ones start at around $20k. Even $400 to $500 per square foot for top-of-the-line examples is not uncommon!

NYW&B

 

[IronBeltKen]

I like to model the Iron&Steel industry. Since I want to be able to run point-to-point mill trains that look at least vaguely prototypical, I really have no choice but to scratchbuild/kitbash the majority of my structures. The few that Walthers makes look too much like...um, Walthers! IOW They are too easily recognizable, I want my layout to look different from the next guy's up the road.

Having said that, I must confess I did buy one Walthers build-up: their Golden Valley Depot. My then-7yr-old daughter wanted to have a 2nd place to stop her passenger trains at on my otherwise freight-only layout, and I simply didn't have the time to build her one myself.

 

[mdcustom]

David, yes in the past I have done some work for custom layout builders, not a lot since I have been booked four months out for the past two years. Most times when a layout builder contacts me they need something fast to complete a deadline which does not fit with my scheduling.

As for the demand in O scale. I had modeled in HO since the early-60's so it was also a radical change for me. Once I had built some in O though I decided to personally switch my layout to O also since the details possible and the physical heft of the trains really is nice. While I do attend a show or two each year as a vendor, I have only gone to one "O scale" show, mostly I set up at narrow gauge shows which cover all scales.

 

[jbaakko]

I understand that there are complete layout builders that get pretty large commissions for providing - I would hazard to guess - well-heeled customers with complete, ready-to-run layouts. Just out of curiosity, are any of these turn-key layout providers also clients of structure builders such as yourself?

David

RailDreams, met the owner, Richard, GREAT guy. I used to shop at his shop in Lake Linden MI, before he decided the customer base for that was not great enough. Got many of my early Athearn & Roundhouse WC stuff from him.

 

[toddmc09]

Oh Yea! You gotta build' em. That's what makes the hobby enjoyable for me, and I actually find the building of the kits, mostly wood, to be relaxing and thereaputic. I actually enjoy the building and detailing the scenes more than the running of trains for the most part, I have been building since I was 10 years old and my Grandfather let me ruin my first Model Power houses under construction kit, glue everywhere, it weren't pretty, but Iwas hooked. although I love my little steam and diesel engines and freight cars also.

 

[ICG/SOU]

I'm one of the two that said I like built ups. However, I actually like a mixture of both. Kinda like rolling stock...most of it is ready to run, but I still come across a Athearn blue box kit or two that I want.

The Walthers Pella Depot bears a good resemblance to the Southern depot in my hometown. I saw it in built up form and purchased it. I didn't know they made it in a kit too.

When I'm done, I'll end up with maybe 3 or 4 structures out of 15 to 20 that are built ups. The rest will be kits, some I've already built, some I have yet to build.

I know that I will enjoy my layout because even if I didn't build that depot, I still built the benchwork, wired it all, laid the track, troubleshot, senicked, etc. I will have pride in ownership.

 

[rlundy90]

As MDcustom has stated, there isn't much call for HO scale buildings,as they are too time consuming to build and actually make money at. On the other hand Nscalers are always complaining they can't find a lot of the structures they need in kit form. These would be cheap to build in wood and wouldn't take nearly as long as HO or the larger scales, as the detail isn't as great. As for myself, I like nothing better than a nice challenging wood kit to build. I must say that the large scale stuff that MDCustom does are very tempting also. Problem is that in Canada it would be very hard to get a good customer base, because the larger scales aren't very popular, like in the US.