Athearn's Latest Price Increases: Im out...


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Sure, I've detailed plenty. Built resin kits. Been there, still doing that. But that's really not the issue here. Railcat refernced Kadee and Tangent, along with Intermontain. These are three hight quality manufacturers who produce models with a very high level of detail, at price points right around this new Athearn car. So my question is, if you don't balk at their prices, then why balk at a model from Athearn that has the same level of detail?

Sure you can take a BB car and get it to this level. What will you pay for the etched metal roofwalk kit, the brake detail, the grabs and so forth? Then add in your time, which is worth something. Now how close in cost are you to the fully detailed car? In the interest of having some hope of getting a layout done to a reasonable level of completion, some (in fact many) modelers are opting to go this route. Me included. If I can get the generic prototype stuff at a nice level of detail, I will, and I'll build the oddball stuff & detail it. It's nice to have the option to do this, and kind of silly (IMO) to fuss at the manufacturers for giving the market exactly what it asked for. For those wanting to go the BB route, there are thousands of these things out there at swap meets, as well as Accurail, Bowser, and so forth. Cheap freight cars are not going away, and there are plenty of current Athearn RTR cars that are nowhere near this expensive. They didn't take the whole RTR line to this price point you know ;)
 
Opt Out-II

A few points I'd like to address:
MSRP: This is a reference point. Many of us "never pay list" for anything, models included. But, as the list rises so does the discounted price - thus an increase in any event.

It is not my wish to imply that Walthers or Athearn models are not very nice in many cases. That their price increases have far exceeded anything from other manufacturers of rolling stock is indisputable, I believe.

Only yesterday I looked at two Athearn (acid) tank cars in a hobby shop. One was in the typical Athearn package at $23.99 vs. one in a Genesis package for $32.99 - and with the plastic couplers. What justifies this amount of price increase? Walthers has been charging some $39 list for auto racks for awhile; in fact, this particular move was what got me paying particular attention to what was happening, with Athearn soon following the example. That was a huge jump from a list in the upper 20s with no visible change in the model; with other equipment prices rapidly following suit. Look at a Walthers coil car and its price vs. a Red Caboose.
Walthers is creeping up to $42 list for one this summer, vs. $37.95 for the well-detailed Red Caboose models due during the same period.

At a time when inflation is running rampant one expects some extent of increase. However, it seems the corporate model is for increases to be piled on at excessive levels while wages or cost-of-living increases for retirees do not keep pace and saving potential has been negated by the FED. Thus one must pay particular attention to who the offenders are - and I think Athearn and Walthers have nominated themselves to the Hall of Shame in such respect.
 
Not to mention that the Red Caboose cars are ready to go while the Walthers ones require the modeler to install and paint the grabs. I have no problems doing so, but why should I pay more to do it myself?
 
Espeefan said:
... For those wanting to go the BB route, there are thousands of these things out there at swap meets...
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The one issue I see with this is that while there are plenty of BB kits on ebay, swap meets, etc…, the LHS is no longer part of the equation. Between cheap, internet ordered RC stuff from Asia and used Model RR stuff on eBay, sometimes I’m amazed that the LHS stays in business.

I’d be willing to pay a few bucks extra to buy a new BB kit from the LHS, but I just can’t justify spending $25 + for a new RTR kit from the LHS (If they even have what I want) when I can get what I want in BB form from ebay for < $10.
 
The one problem is what is gonna happen when all the BB n roundhouse kits sold on ebay and swap meets are gone??
 
Athearn is also losing there sales force.
Think of all of the hobby shops in your area that have gone out of bussiness.
That was there sales force.
Athearn has a policy of only selling to brick and mortor stores and if that is declining then there profit margin is going down.
 
That is also Walthers' policy. I can see why. By selling to brick and mortar stores, they are keeping the stores in business. Without local stores, it kills the already dwindling stream of people coming into the hobby.
 
I get most of the kits I need from Ebay and members on this and other forums for reasonably low prices if not free. Quite a bit of what I have is rebuilt from junk people were throwing out. A piece from here and a piece from there.
 
Well fellas, I can appreciate your theories, but without the profit & loss statement from Athearn, that's all you've really got. I think Athearn has been making up ground and playing catch up on some prices. Their SP passenger car for example, was $54.95 for the first run. That was about ten bucks less than an equivalent car from Walthers (don't forget, it came with a light kit, and a more detailed interior than Walthers offers). They lost their butt on that model. That's why they never did the rest of the train, and why the second run went up 10 bucks a car. Early cement hoppers with metal roofwalks were under $20.00. There was a time when they were below their competition's prices. I'm sure their profits were below the competition's too. Looks like Horizon put a stop to that. Ir's also possible other companies are getting better prices from some of the Chinese suppliers.

I don't go for conspiracy theories much, and I don't believe that there are any nefarious plots to gouge the hobbyist. I do believe that things are going to continue to get more expensive,and top quality stuff will keep going up. OTOH these models are a far cry from the old BB kits and wide bodied Geeps we used to get. Since the stuff is selling, obviously not everyone shares your frustrations. And you do still have low cost alternatives.

At some point the market will top out. I wonder where that will be?
 
You want to save some money on this hobby, stop buying RTR rolling stock, do yourself a favor and learn how to build models! Accurail and Bowser and a few others still offer easy to build kits! These kits are far more sturdy then the RTR stuff available and will last a lifetime with simple care! $30-$40.00 for a freight car is an absolute foolish amount to pay!

Come-on, building these simple freight car kits is not that difficult and if you refuse to learn how, than what are you even doing in any "modeling" hobby? If you say they just don't run as well, your only fooling yourself, because if you can't get them to work as well, this is again because of your lack of modeling ability!
 
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NP2626 said:
You want to save some money on this hobby, stop buying RTR rolling stock, do yourself a favor and learn how to build models! Accurail and Bowser and a few others still offer easy to build kits! These kits are far more sturdy then the RTR stuff available and will last a lifetime with simple care! $30-$40.00 for a freight car is an absolute foolish amount to pay!
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In your opinion. Lots of manufacturers besides Athearn are now at this price point. And the stuff is selling.

NP2626 said:
Come-on, building these simple freight car kits is not that difficult and if you refuse to learn how, than what are you even doing in any "modeling" hobby? If you say they just don't run as well, your only fooling yourself, because if you can't get them to work as well, this is again because of your lack of modeling ability!
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Um, ok, but these low cost alternatives have already been pointed out. What happens when the car you want isn't available as a kit? Modeling ability isn't really the point. It's where prices are going with the RTR stuff. Now..again..I will point out that this is only effecting certain highly detailed new models in the RTR line. Older stuff and stuff with updated tooling costs less than newly tooled models with lots of detail (common sense ;)) The entire RTR line has not been raised to these price points, and those that have are equal in detail level to Kadee, Tangent, and so forth.
 
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NP2626 said:
You want to save some money on this hobby, stop buying RTR rolling stock, do yourself a favor and learn how to build models! Accurail and Bowser and a few others still offer easy to build kits! These kits are far more sturdy then the RTR stuff available and will last a lifetime with simple care! $30-$40.00 for a freight car is an absolute foolish amount to pay! Come-on, building these simple freight car kits is not that difficult and if you refuse to learn how, than what are you even doing in any &quot;modeling&quot; hobby? If you say they just don't run as well, your only fooling yourself, because if you can't get them to work as well, this is again because of your lack of modeling ability!
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I take it you've never heard of Atlas's Trainman line.
 
Part of the problem here is, I think a lack of understanding.

First, an early post said "wow, the same car was $30.00 5 years ago." Wrong. This is a new model released in December. Ditto for the containers. So how could they cost anything 5 years ago? Oops! Didn't check our information, did we? :rolleyes:

It seems as products get added to the RTR line, and as the models get more sopisticated, the price goes up. No big surprise there really. You have new tooling to pay for, runs are smaller these days, which runs up the unit price, and then of course the Chinese labor siituation continues to get worse.

I won't be buying this one, because it does not fit my era, but I have spent similar money on models that do. As for "build a kit instead", I happen to like building resin kits. Mostly those by Sunshine Models, and a few by Westerfield, and Southern Car & Foundry. Care to guess where they are in the market? Sunshine kits are selling in the high thirties to mid forties per kit these days, and you still have to buy trucks & couplers. I buy these because they are of unusual prototypes that are not available in plastic. I also like to build wooden structures, and have a thing for craftsman kits by BEST or Foscale. They get a little expensive too. :eek:

Point being: Athearn isn't marking up the same model over an over just to gouge their customers. They are expanding their offerings, and the new stuff is more expensive than the old. It's also very high quality, from what I have seen. Now I also have blue box on the roster, as well as Accurail and Bowser :D. Like anyone else I will save a buck where I can, but costs are going up and it looks like they aren't done yet. Maybe the manufacturers will move to India, and we'll get a reprieve. I won't hold my breath though. It would cost even more to move back to the US. I think we've had a nice period of low costs that has come to an end. So we'll have to bite the bullet if we really want the model, scrounge the swap meets, or look out for sales and discounts. Which is what we've always done anyway.
 
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I don't see anyone missunderstanding anything! My point is: I want kits!! I want to save the money it would cost for the high priced RTR freight cars and buy maybe 2 to 4 freight car kits for the price of one RTR car! You have the "fun money" it takes to buy strings of the high priced RTR cars, I really don't have a problem with that, excepting your giving the manufacturers the belief that todays model railroaders want expensive RTR!
 
NP2626 said:
I don't see anyone missunderstanding anything! My point is: I want kits!! I want to save the money it would cost for the high priced RTR freight cars and buy maybe 2 to 4 freight car kits for the price of one RTR car! You have the "fun money" it takes to buy strings of the high priced RTR cars, I really don't have a problem with that, excepting your giving the manufacturers the belief that todays model railroaders want expensive RTR!
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Then head off to the train show and buy yourself a boatload of bluebox, or to Bowser, who still offers kits, or to Accurail. Kits are still there. But if the car you want isn't available as a kit, and you really want it, what will you do?

The market has moved away from kits, like it or not. If you talk to the folks at Intermountain, they will tell you that RTR outsells kits by a huge margin. Some years ago Bowser had a boatload of kits that were basically shelf queens. They sent them off to China, had them assembled, and brought them back. They were gone in a week. Sold out. 50-60 hour work weeks are leaving many of us less hobby time, so we still build kits, but less of them, in the hopes of getting a layout functional. BTW good kits are also getting more expensive.
 
When I want kits, there is no convincing me otherwise! I absolutly don't care what the rest of you want! Your happy with the direction the hobby is going with RTR, that's fine, I am not!

To me, there is one hell of a lot of fun in building, I'm sorry you guys just don't understand this!

This is a dead-end discussion I want what I want and am entitled to it. You want what you want and are entitled to that.

It does however show how even if I state point blank what I want, some of you think you need to prove me wrong for wanting what I want!
 
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