For a small section of lake, you might look at Jim's (HO Explorer) method when he made a pond on pages 66,68,69&71, beginning here. http://www.modelrailroadforums.com/...-Pinacle-Creek-Mining-amp-Timber-Co-RR/page66
The wife's HO Atlas layout...
- Thread starter wombat457
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First, thanks for the link tootnkumin...I am debating this very subject in my mind as well and will look at this immediately after I post this. Hopefully I find some answers.
And Wombat, I must say I certainly admire your commitment to start over with new track. I must say, having just completed my trackwork that Peco is absolutely everything that its cracked up to be. You will love it. It's really easy to work with!!!
Look forward to the rest of your journey!!!
Glad your track work came together and that your thoughts about the Peco are so positive. That certainly boosts my confidence with my decision.
At the risk of hi jacking my own thread here, did the Peco come with pre drilled holes in the ties by any chance? If not, did you drill holes or use another method to place your track and hold it in place?
I know exactly what you mean, especially the last sentance. This is all my wife wants as well.
I just received the "bulk" track this morning, the turnouts, terminal and standard joiners arrive this morning (Friday) so nope, haven't laid any of it yet. What you see is still the Atlas track.
Every now and then I become dejected with the layout not going the way I envisage or more to the point, my not being able to do something the way I perceive it. Rather than persevere with it, and risk screwing something beyond repair, I take a step back, take a break and do something, such as the bridge, that is different. Taking a break from things, including the forums, lets me think about the "big picture" and to work out how to achieve the end result.
Other things happen that take priority over the layout as well, and things happen that prevent me from continuing that simply frustrate the living day lights out of me. For example, my plan for this evening was to have the top section of the tunnel formed and ready for plaster cloth, plastering and then painting. Just after I took the photo (above) the poor quality, cheap Woodlands Hot Wire Cutter poo'd itself, bring everything to a grinding halt, sure, I could have gone back to the good old fashioned knife sculpturing, but that would not have achieved what I want achieved, and would take forever to do. Due to this, a new and "good" hot wire foam cutter has been purchased but am going to have to wait for it to arrive from California. I'm guessing it is going to be about a week before I see it.
All in all, I am within spitting distance of completing what needs to be done to be able to run trains. This screw up with the hot wire cutter has only delayed that from happening.
Absolutely!
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ledzeppelinfan1
Member
First, thanks for the link tootnkumin...I am debating this very subject in my mind as well and will look at this immediately after I post this. Hopefully I find some answers.
And Wombat, I must say I certainly admire your commitment to start over with new track. I must say, having just completed my trackwork that Peco is absolutely everything that its cracked up to be. You will love it. It's really easy to work with!!!
Look forward to the rest of your journey!!!
wombat457
I'm the one
Jim's work is very impressive, no question about that ad that is the way that I have done my small ponds, creeks etc in the past.
In this case, it isn't so much getting the color of the lake right as around here they are natural with mud/rock bottoms. Nor is it actually forming the cliffs and so forth. The issue that I am having is a toss up between having the lake with "actual depth" verses perceived depth through color, as Jim has done and I have done in the past.
Do I create the cliffs down to the water level plus a 1/4 inch, then flatten the the lake out, or do I continue the cliffs past the water line to create a more realistic below water look?
If I use the first option, then I need to use color to create the impression of depth BUT only 1/4" of Liquitex or two or three layers. This is the easier and cheaper option. If I use option 2, then I will still need to use color (obviously) but will also need some where closer to between 12 to 15 layers of Liquitex to create the depth. Frankly, I don't know if Liquitex will hold it's transparency with that amount of layers being applied, and that too is a concern. The most I have put down in the past has been 5 layers with no real problem in terms of clarity.
My gut tells me to go with the second option which will leave me room to include sub water surface weeds, rocks etc, maybe even some "junk".
This will be, I think, one of those things that is going to take me awhile to complete, especially when you consider that my lake covers about 2 sq feet of the layout in an irregular shape and is not something that I can do then change if it does not look right or go to plan. It also isn't something that I can mock up, as I normally would, due to the cost. This really is one of those situations where I only get one chance to get it right.
Anyway, when all's said and done, just makes think I should have put in an outdoor swimming pool some where instead
In this case, it isn't so much getting the color of the lake right as around here they are natural with mud/rock bottoms. Nor is it actually forming the cliffs and so forth. The issue that I am having is a toss up between having the lake with "actual depth" verses perceived depth through color, as Jim has done and I have done in the past.
Do I create the cliffs down to the water level plus a 1/4 inch, then flatten the the lake out, or do I continue the cliffs past the water line to create a more realistic below water look?
If I use the first option, then I need to use color to create the impression of depth BUT only 1/4" of Liquitex or two or three layers. This is the easier and cheaper option. If I use option 2, then I will still need to use color (obviously) but will also need some where closer to between 12 to 15 layers of Liquitex to create the depth. Frankly, I don't know if Liquitex will hold it's transparency with that amount of layers being applied, and that too is a concern. The most I have put down in the past has been 5 layers with no real problem in terms of clarity.
My gut tells me to go with the second option which will leave me room to include sub water surface weeds, rocks etc, maybe even some "junk".
This will be, I think, one of those things that is going to take me awhile to complete, especially when you consider that my lake covers about 2 sq feet of the layout in an irregular shape and is not something that I can do then change if it does not look right or go to plan. It also isn't something that I can mock up, as I normally would, due to the cost. This really is one of those situations where I only get one chance to get it right.
Anyway, when all's said and done, just makes think I should have put in an outdoor swimming pool some where instead
wombat457
I'm the one
First, thanks for the link tootnkumin...I am debating this very subject in my mind as well and will look at this immediately after I post this. Hopefully I find some answers.
And Wombat, I must say I certainly admire your commitment to start over with new track. I must say, having just completed my trackwork that Peco is absolutely everything that its cracked up to be. You will love it. It's really easy to work with!!!
Look forward to the rest of your journey!!!
Glad your track work came together and that your thoughts about the Peco are so positive. That certainly boosts my confidence with my decision.
At the risk of hi jacking my own thread here, did the Peco come with pre drilled holes in the ties by any chance? If not, did you drill holes or use another method to place your track and hold it in place?
ledzeppelinfan1
Member
I read that it didn't come with pre-drilled holes, so I never looked. Lemme take a look real quick...tick tock tick tock...nope, nothing not even a incomplete starter divot. So if you want holes, break out the drill bit. I used Liquid Nails Spread thin on cork and thumb tacks to hold the track down. It seems to have worked pretty well. I'm sure if I went and screwed around with it I could dislodge it, but nobody is going to be doing that now are they!?!?! And then once ballast is applied and glued, all the stronger. Might wanna read through those tips I threw in on that Peco thread...might be glad you did!!!
ledzeppelinfan1
Member
ledzeppelinfan1
Member
BTW, Wombat.
Thought I'd let you know before I leave for work for the next couple days. With Peco Flex BOTH rails move...so when laying curves it doesnt matter which rail goes on the inside. Simple.
Thought I'd let you know before I leave for work for the next couple days. With Peco Flex BOTH rails move...so when laying curves it doesnt matter which rail goes on the inside. Simple.
wombat457
I'm the one
Lakeside progress...
Starting to move along in leaps and bounds now. Am hopeful of having the structural work completed by the end of this weekend or VERY shortly after. Then the painting and detail work begins in earnest.
So, have started forming the top of the tunnel section on the right side of the layout. Instead of messing around with the 1" EPS I decided to buy two sheets of 24" X 18" X 4" foam blocks, especially as this top section is going to be removal for access to the tunnel track and, inevitable, derailments in the tunnel.
What will be the exit portal of the tunnel, or south end:
At the moment it looks pretty ordinary and out of place. I have a fair bit of cutting to do to get it all to look in perspective and natural. That will be done sometime tomorrow I'm guessing.
Have also been working on the road that will join the town to the lake area. This is being done as a scratch built road so to speak and am still widening it to get t looking like an authentic 1 1/2 lane minor road. Lots of plaster work to get it there, nothing that is worth a photo at the moment. Come to think of it, your probably thinking very little of what I have posted is photo worthy.
Anyway, keep watching guys, things will start to change fairly quickly now.
Starting to move along in leaps and bounds now. Am hopeful of having the structural work completed by the end of this weekend or VERY shortly after. Then the painting and detail work begins in earnest.
So, have started forming the top of the tunnel section on the right side of the layout. Instead of messing around with the 1" EPS I decided to buy two sheets of 24" X 18" X 4" foam blocks, especially as this top section is going to be removal for access to the tunnel track and, inevitable, derailments in the tunnel.
What will be the exit portal of the tunnel, or south end:
At the moment it looks pretty ordinary and out of place. I have a fair bit of cutting to do to get it all to look in perspective and natural. That will be done sometime tomorrow I'm guessing.
Have also been working on the road that will join the town to the lake area. This is being done as a scratch built road so to speak and am still widening it to get t looking like an authentic 1 1/2 lane minor road. Lots of plaster work to get it there, nothing that is worth a photo at the moment. Come to think of it, your probably thinking very little of what I have posted is photo worthy.
Anyway, keep watching guys, things will start to change fairly quickly now.
ledzeppelinfan1
Member
Did you already lay all your Peco flex? Anyways, there are no bad pics really as it shows the process and makes the 'after' comparison photos look that much better!!! I was wondering about you as you seemed to disappear for a bit. Making a layout of the size you and I are makes it very tempting to want to get in a hurry because the layout really can be finished within a month or two if you work hard, but I have to constantly (and I mean CONSTANTLY) remind myself that I'll reap the reward if I take my time and do things the best I can.
I really want to just be done and start playing with my toys though!!!
I really want to just be done and start playing with my toys though!!!
wombat457
I'm the one
I know exactly what you mean, especially the last sentance. This is all my wife wants as well.
I just received the "bulk" track this morning, the turnouts, terminal and standard joiners arrive this morning (Friday) so nope, haven't laid any of it yet. What you see is still the Atlas track.
Every now and then I become dejected with the layout not going the way I envisage or more to the point, my not being able to do something the way I perceive it. Rather than persevere with it, and risk screwing something beyond repair, I take a step back, take a break and do something, such as the bridge, that is different. Taking a break from things, including the forums, lets me think about the "big picture" and to work out how to achieve the end result.
Other things happen that take priority over the layout as well, and things happen that prevent me from continuing that simply frustrate the living day lights out of me. For example, my plan for this evening was to have the top section of the tunnel formed and ready for plaster cloth, plastering and then painting. Just after I took the photo (above) the poor quality, cheap Woodlands Hot Wire Cutter poo'd itself, bring everything to a grinding halt, sure, I could have gone back to the good old fashioned knife sculpturing, but that would not have achieved what I want achieved, and would take forever to do. Due to this, a new and "good" hot wire foam cutter has been purchased but am going to have to wait for it to arrive from California. I'm guessing it is going to be about a week before I see it.
All in all, I am within spitting distance of completing what needs to be done to be able to run trains. This screw up with the hot wire cutter has only delayed that from happening.
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wombat457
I'm the one
It just gets better and better - NOT! Looks as though the layout is being "layed up" for an indefinite period of time.
This morning I went to pay a bill and my card was declined. I discovered that my card had been used fraudulently at 8:00 am this morning ,; as such, it has been cancelled. Now I have to wait for a new card to arrive from Australia. Last time this happened, last November, it cost me over $1200 that I am still trying to reclaim.
Anyway, I am for all intent and purpose flat broke with no access to my money and; therefore, no way of being able to buy the last few things I need to complete the layout. I just hope that I get the new card a damn sight quicker than the 4 plus weeks it took last time
This morning I went to pay a bill and my card was declined. I discovered that my card had been used fraudulently at 8:00 am this morning ,; as such, it has been cancelled. Now I have to wait for a new card to arrive from Australia. Last time this happened, last November, it cost me over $1200 that I am still trying to reclaim.
Anyway, I am for all intent and purpose flat broke with no access to my money and; therefore, no way of being able to buy the last few things I need to complete the layout. I just hope that I get the new card a damn sight quicker than the 4 plus weeks it took last time
mantua mike
Member
Good luck. That really stinks.
ledzeppelinfan1
Member
Oh damn. I'm sorry to hear that. Really. People really suck sometimes.
wombat457
I'm the one
Thanks and yeah, it does "suck" and is the complete opposite to what N Scaler experienced. Talk about contrasting situations.
I think the thing that really peeved me was the fact that I am so close to having everything I need for the layout and was about to order the extra electronics: a PSX-4 Circuit Breaker and quantity of SC1 Signal Decoders. The purchase of those items has now been put on hold and, therefore, holds up the completion of the layout for operations.
I had just received the rest of my Peco Track as well, and was looking forward to laying it. I thought better of it with the mood I was in.
All I can say is that there are some real low life, good for nothing scum in this world.
I think the thing that really peeved me was the fact that I am so close to having everything I need for the layout and was about to order the extra electronics: a PSX-4 Circuit Breaker and quantity of SC1 Signal Decoders. The purchase of those items has now been put on hold and, therefore, holds up the completion of the layout for operations.
I had just received the rest of my Peco Track as well, and was looking forward to laying it. I thought better of it with the mood I was in.
All I can say is that there are some real low life, good for nothing scum in this world.
ledzeppelinfan1
Member
I totally understand being furious. Maybe do what you can with the layout up until those electronics come in...when your mood improves. But definitely take the time to vent. Or ask yourself if you really need them. Mine is barebones when it comes to electronics...hell, I have Tyco powerpacks (three of them!!!)...no lights in building or anything. I figure those things can be added later if I ever need them.
You have all of your track, right? Basically, if you have enough to do all of your track, run trains, and do scenery, I would continue and worry about the extra frilly things later. Don't let it get the best of you. But yeah...still sucks. Sorry.
You have all of your track, right? Basically, if you have enough to do all of your track, run trains, and do scenery, I would continue and worry about the extra frilly things later. Don't let it get the best of you. But yeah...still sucks. Sorry.
wombat457
I'm the one
That is pretty much what I am doing, going on with smaller projects for the layout and doing little bits of scenery, here and there. Your also right about the electronics being "niceties" and not being essential for the running of the layout. I have everything I need to make it work, DCC system, track, trains.
Thanks Stephen, guess I just needed a kick in "ahse" to return my focus to the doable, rather than worrying about what is, essentially, out of my immediate control.
Thanks Stephen, guess I just needed a kick in "ahse" to return my focus to the doable, rather than worrying about what is, essentially, out of my immediate control.
ledzeppelinfan1
Member
It happens, bro. I'd act the same way...sometimes it takes someone who isn't 'in the middle of it' to remind you of the big picture.
wombat457
I'm the one
It happens, bro. I'd act the same way...sometimes it takes someone who isn't 'in the middle of it' to remind you of the big picture.
Absolutely!
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