Cracked axle gears on Proto 2000

[frog]

This has been brought up here before I am fairly sure, and if I understand it the Athern gears fix this. I am hesitate about ordering the gears from Walthers if they are the same design as they may and probably will crack in the future. Have the Proto 2000 gears been redesigned by chance? It seems to me the sleeves on the ones I have are too thin.

All my locos were bought new back in the mid 1990's when Lifelike made them.
I have about 12 or 16 in all, just found out about mine cracking today when I was cleaning my GP-18's.

Would it be a better fix to order from Athern or Walthers?

 

[jeffrey-wimberly]

The old gears came from a bad batch that had the holes for the axles too small. The new gears are made to the proper specs but if you're doubtful about that the Athearn gears are a good replacement. I've used them myself.

 

[jayl1]

The Athearn part is #60024. I just did a BL-2 last night using the Athearn part. They are available from Athearn.com.

 

[frog]

I have other than the GP-18's a set of FA-2's along with some SW type yard switchers.

Does the same gear fit all ?

I might as well replace all of them, cracked or not as I am sure they are all early production ones.

As long as the Walthers new gears are OK I am fine with that but if the Athearn work I don't guess it really matters.

Anyway, thanks for your help on this.

 

[TMLW]

I have over 40 P2K units and replacing the gears is one of the first things I do to them.

 

[frog]

I checked through my boxes and found a Athearn F7 unpainted engine and B unit I picked up years ago, have never done anything with it. I took out the axle assemblies, wheels and all, and replaced them in my Proto 2000 GP-18's. They ran like clockwork.

I noticed that the Athearns had the gear a bit wider, with very little sideplay. With the Proto 2000 units the gear width allowed play to the extent to where the bearings would almost come out of their bracket. Perhaps the new Proto 2000 gears are a bit wider as well? I don't know.

At this point I am considering getting the Athearn wheels too, if I can get that same type of precision fit.

I just have to see if the same type gear will work on my different types of 2000's.

 

[lmackattack]

I have
6 GP18s
4 FA1/FB1

I replaced them all with new P2k Gears.no problems as of yet. Some of the Athearn axels were made from cheep metal. they collected dirt faster and just looked rough. I had put a set in a GP18 when my LHS did not have the P2K gears in stock. I took them out after just a few hours running at the club. they just collected dirt to fast and disrupted operation... I put P2K gears in and have not had to clean them yet...

just my .02

 

[kbkchooch]

I have to echo the previous posts. Go with the Athearn gears, you'le never have to do it again!
Athearn wheels I would skip. They are made from sintered Iron . True, there is a slight traction/adhesion advanage, but the noise is incredible! Plus they are harder to clean, as the wheel faces are rougher than the P2K wheels.
How bad are the Proto axles?
Just got another Proto BL2, still sealed in its original box. Guess what, all 4 axles were cracked!
Granted, its 10 years old, but still, sealed in the box it failed!
But so far, all 10 units I have installed Athearn gears in have not failed, and a few have a ton of miles on them!

 

[frog]

Good point about the wheels. I just dropped the whole assy in simply because it was a bit quicker and I wanted to see if they would interchange. The Athearn gears, being wider, should provide the tighter fix to reduce sideplay even using the Proto 2000 wheels and bearings.

I use a Walthers Brightboy to clean my wheels, is there anything better? Thought about using a shaped eraser, the kind used for pencils.

I found that all my Lifelike locos don't have the same type drive gear. Last night I worked on a small yard switcher, I forgot the type, an SW something. Somewhere the box might still be around. This type has copper strips that fit onto the tips of the wheels with brackets that snap into place around the truck frame. The whole gearbox is quite narrow and the axle gear is a different design. It took a while for me to figure out how to take it down to the point to where I could remove the axle assy.

It is a LifeLike loco but maybe not a part of the Proto 2000 series? It also was bought back in the mid 1990's.

Anyway, I think I'll go with the Athearn gears to fix the problem.

 

[jeffrey-wimberly]

If the Athearn wheels are the older ones (dull dark gray in appearance) they are the sintered iron wheels. The newer ones are nickel-silver plated and are much better. I used them in a P2K GP30 and two P2K FA's.The wheels look like the ones that come with the P2K units.

 

[kbkchooch]

It is a LifeLike loco but maybe not a part of the Proto 2000 series? It also was bought back in the mid 1990's.

Yeah, that Life-Like engine is kinda like a Toyota Tercel, the P2K is more like a Lexus.........Same company.....whole lotta difference!


As far as cleaning wheels is concerned, I cannot ever recommend using a Bright Boy or anything else abrasive. Everytime you scratch a wheel or a rail with an abrasive you make another space to collect dirt.
Chemical cleaners work best. I'm going to leave it at that.

 

[frog]

These wheels I think are the older ones, from the early 1990's or before. They have the dull grey "rough" look. I'll stick with the Proto 2000 wheels as the issue appears to be the gears having too thin a sleeve and not the wheels having a slightly oversize shaft.

 

[Doughless]

I have other than the GP-18's a set of FA-2's along with some SW type yard switchers.

Does the same gear fit all ?

No. But the SW's axle gears should not be cracked since they are of a different design than the GP's. I don't know about the FA. If they have the same truck design as the GP then they are likely cracked too, and can be fixed with the same gears as the GP.

 

[frog]

Very good. Thank you. That should thin down how many I need to order.

I kind of went crazy on the GP-18's when they came out.

Mostly I model the L&N but I also got some Seaboard Air Line, Southern, and Norfolk Southern as well.

 

[kbkchooch]

No. But the SW's axle gears should not be cracked since they are of a different design than the GP's. I don't know about the FA. If they have the same truck design as the GP then they are likely cracked too, and can be fixed with the same gears as the GP.

The Geeps, the FA2's and the BL2's all take the same gear. Keeps it kinda simple!

 

[frog]

Well I received my gears from Athearn today and replaced the ones in my Proto-2000 Fa-2 locos, they worked like a charm. Of the 8 I replaced 7 were cracked, some worse than others.

I got these back in the '90's when they came out, 2 locos and a B unit which is a dummy. Maybe the drive gears in the B unit will be ok, no motor of course but if they have cracked gears as well it could allow the wheels to be so loose they could go out of spec as to rail fitting.

I appreciate all your help with this.

 

[Wojo]

Yeah, that Life-Like engine is kinda like a Toyota Tercel, the P2K is more like a Lexus.........Same company.....whole lotta difference!


Yea, also like Toyota they concealed and denied the gear problem.

I have a few GP9s and GP30s with the gear problem, and eventually, I'll get around to regearing them. I also have a Walthers era P2K RS27, which is absolutely a beauty, however due to the extensive side play of the wheels, It shorts out on most of my DCC friendly #6 Kato switches. A gear and wheel swap with a surplus Athearn RTR GP35 might solve the problem.
Never considered this until I read this thread.

Joe

I checked through my boxes and found a Athearn F7 unpainted engine and B unit I picked up years ago, have never done anything with it. I took out the aIxle assemblies, wheels and all, and replaced them in my Proto 2000 GP-18's. They ran like clockwork.

I noticed that the Athearns had the gear a bit wider, with very little sideplay. With the Proto 2000 units the gear width allowed play to the extent to where the bearings would almost come out of their bracket. Perhaps the new Proto 2000 gears are a bit wider as well? I don't know.

At this point I am considering getting the Athearn wheels too, if I can get that same type of precision fit.

I just have to see if the same type gear will work on my different types of 2000's.

 

[kbkchooch]

At this point I am considering getting the Athearn wheels too, if I can get that same type of precision fit.

I just have to see if the same type gear will work on my different types of 2000's.

Athearn wheels will work, however because they are sintered Iron and not Nickel silver or brass, they are noisier. Adhesion is better, but also they get dirtier,faster.
Depends on what you can tolerate as a trade off.

I've got about a dozen P2K's that have all been regeared. Havn't had a problem since.

 

[Espeefan]

Yeah, that Life-Like engine is kinda like a Toyota Tercel, the P2K is more like a Lexus.........Same company.....whole lotta difference!


Yea, also like Toyota they concealed and denied the gear problem.

Ridiculous! They gave away more wheelsets (wheels included, not just the gears) than it would take to re-gear every loco they made, and only over the last year or so started charging for them.

The best fix for these is the OEM gears. Athearn's are slightly different, and are cast, where P2K's are cut. Better quality and the proper gear geometry.

 

[kjd]

I find the Athearn gears last about 15 years. Some of my older Athearn locos have recently needed their gears replaced. I also have 3 P2K GP30s and 2 GP9s all of which have had their gears replaced with Athearn.