RailFlyer????????
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- Start date
If the company filed for bankruptcy, I would expect that he no longer owns the 'intellectual property', the designs, patents, tooling, patterns, even the programming for the machining of the old parts. Those would typically be considered assets, which would have to be handled by the trustee for disposal / sale to satisfy creditors.
DairyStateDad
Mumbling in the corner
If they filed for bankruptcy, does anyone know what jurisdiction it would be in? If US, it would be federal court, and records are available online for anyone with a PACER account. But I think someone said that this co. was Canadian. I don't know what, if any, court records are online there.
From the DairyStatePhone
From the DairyStatePhone
CMMR
Member
This is from one of the other forums, posted on Railflyer's former Facebook page Nov 28th:
"After consultation yesterday, all work on Railflyer Model Prototypes Inc. will officially cease today and the entities property ceded to the trustee.
"Plans are in the works to enable another company to sell the product line and get orders shipped but this will depend on an agreement being met with the creditors under their guidance.
"Thank you for the seven years of support. As for guidance on orders, you will be contacted when things are sorted out, please do not deluge me or anybody else with questions as none of us have gone through this before, and final control of the inventory is going to be the hand of our creditors but everything is intended to get sent out or replaced. The time this will take as of yet is unknown.
"All the best,
"Christopher Howard"
"After consultation yesterday, all work on Railflyer Model Prototypes Inc. will officially cease today and the entities property ceded to the trustee.
"Plans are in the works to enable another company to sell the product line and get orders shipped but this will depend on an agreement being met with the creditors under their guidance.
"Thank you for the seven years of support. As for guidance on orders, you will be contacted when things are sorted out, please do not deluge me or anybody else with questions as none of us have gone through this before, and final control of the inventory is going to be the hand of our creditors but everything is intended to get sent out or replaced. The time this will take as of yet is unknown.
"All the best,
"Christopher Howard"
Well, I guess my money went to tooling for your parts. You're welcome.
For the 3 benjamins I am out, it wouldn't be cost effective for me to join the bankruptcy filing in Canada.
But I hope others will read these threads and think twice before sending good money after bad to Christopher Howard.
... and that others who have not had to deal with him will stop defending him. Those of us with real experience know how we were treated and won't forget.
Well, I guess my money went to tooling for your parts. You're welcome.
For the 3 benjamins I am out, it wouldn't be cost effective for me to join the bankruptcy filing in Canada.
But I hope others will read these threads and think twice before sending good money after bad to Christopher Howard.
... and that others who have not had to deal with him will stop defending him. Those of us with real experience know how we were treated and won't forget.
I'd be surprised if he came after MRR'ers again, more likely to target some other hobby to fleece next time.
Too big too fast. Saw his stuff at the RPM in Naperville a couple of years ago. Looked good, but mostly too new for me. I thought the traction motors in the trucks a novel concept but had my doubts about pulling power. He may have started out with the best of intentions but wound up with an HO scale ponzi scheme. A shame!
We've got a guy by the name of Foster over here (you may even know him, I believe he may have operated in the states as well), who is a convicted and notorious conman. One of his major cons was a weight loss product, so just because someone actually produces a product and promotes it, doesn't necessarilly mean he has or had a genuine intent. Unfortunately the proof of the pudding is in the eating (not referring to his diet stuff) and the diversion of customers payments for a certain product to fund supposed other product lines is fraud and nothing else.
railBuilderDhd
Active Member
I purchased from Chris many years yes years ago a few items that I never got. So I contacted him and got the bs we all read about and felt I had a right to let others know if how I was treated. Well, fast forward a few years of posting and getting the be from RF I then see Chris posting that he will be suing folks for posting about his business and causing him lost income.
I have never got a thing from him but his work looks great. I'm sorry he doesn't understand business and how to treat customers.
My not going to tell you to buy or not from him. The products look great but...
Dave
I have never got a thing from him but his work looks great. I'm sorry he doesn't understand business and how to treat customers.
My not going to tell you to buy or not from him. The products look great but...
Dave
Bluff and bluster mate, another typical trick.
wright2626
Member
he can attempt to sue, but it is not considered slander if it is not true.
railBuilderDhd
Active Member
I would love to see him come to America to sue me. I've done nothing but let other forum members know of what I experienced in dealing with him. I don't see how he can sue me from Canada so I have no worries about it. I also can try to sue him for my money back but I would rather not and see he make it.
If there's one thing a con-man hates more than anything, it is constant exposure. Keep at him, if only hopefully to prevent others being conned also.
railflyermodel
Member
The Railflyelmodel.com domain finally expired so logging into my email account brought me here.
Wow, a lot of misinformation.
Railflyer Model Prototypes Inc. did not go bankrupt. It is insolvent. Under corporate law, to file bankruptcy is around $10,000 which if there was $10,000 the insolvency would have not occurred.
There have been a tremendous amount of personal attacks on me, which is libel. There was and is no fraud its just a pure and simple business failure. When there is no income, there is no business.
I did file personal bankruptcy in December, 2013. I held on as long as I could.
This was in the amount of $322,000.
It was just a series of hits I couldn't get around.
The first hit was the loss of practically all tooling we started in 2010/2011 due to the inability of the suppliers to finish the work to specification. This amounted to over 20 injection molds supporting the trucks, hoods, and associated details like the fan project.
The second hit was the concentrated online campaign against us that started in late 2011 and again in the spring of 2012. As I stated back then, yes we lost the tooling but it will be replaced. With no new orders it will take longer which is exactly what happened. 90% of the posts were in fact libel, these supposed customers had no orders outstanding.
We did purchase a new CNC from Datron Dynamics Inc. which arrived in July 2012. I was not present at the installation. It was installed by the dealer. The first signs of trouble started within a few days, within two weeks we had two electronic cards fail. After six months, there was a total of five axis driver failures, two motors failures, two interface card failures, and a control panel failure. Servicing fees without actually addressing the problem amounted to $27,000.
There was an error log pulled from the machine during the burn in at the factory which did show electrical issues at the factory, plus a serial number change. The electronics pulled from the machine ARE NOT very high quality and show signs of previous use. This was purchased as a brand new CNC and shipped direct from Germany. After setting up a number of items, we lost two drivers last August. The CNC at this point is dead. The direct purchase of the CNC was $159,000 plus the associated software, hardware for the shop etc.
The fourth and final hit was from our main lender. This was a concerted effort by them and our landlord who started denying access. I was in arrears with rent due to the loss of sales starting in 2012. By 2013, we went from the highest month of $10,000 in March 2012 to an average of $500 per month at the end. So the libel had taken a toll.
We got an eviction notice when our lease came due in September of last year. We reworked a new lease and kept everything happy but the driver fixes to the CNC proved problematic. The dealer was unwilling to replace them and because I sent them out for trouble-shooting, they would not enable us to trade them in for reused ones. The cost per driver under the exchange program is around $1200 with another fee for the core. So it was going to be around $4000 to replace the two drivers. The issue with the machine has not yet been addressed by the dealer and they refuse to do anything unless we pay the service fees. Yes the machine came with a warranty.
The main lender who is a government run community development corporation which decided to call our loans. In the process of doing this, they sued both Railflyer Model Prototypes Inc. and me.
There is a judgement against the corporation for $151,000 and myself which my bankruptcy stayed.
I was able to remove our contents of the shop including inventory. It is in a secure location waiting for the bailiff. The lender will sell the contents to recoup the loan.
With the corporation being insolvent, there is no money to do anything including ship orders.
The sad thing is normal sales in 2012/2013 would have kept things afloat as we have a significant amount of OEM work which once the CNC issues were resolved, would have more than paid for the lost production in China.
So yes, a lot of stress the past few years.
As far as addressing anything to do with Railflyer, I don't have any answers, until the lawsuit judgement is resolved, by the sale of the CNC and contents of the shop, nothing will happen.
I do know that completely rebuilding the CNC with new electronics is $46,000 just for hardware. As for the cause, I am not sure. The dealer blames electrical fluctuations but they did the installation and signed off the outlet, and this doesn't explain the evidence of electrical problems before delivery and after we rewired the shop. It is not normal to have multiple axis failures and control panel issues.
As for going forward, yes some partners and I have started a new corporation. We do have WiFi boards done, they are in firmware development at this point. It is a completely separate company, and at some point we hope to take on the obligations of our previous projects but to do that, the company has to have income.
We have floated the plans to build our own automation for doing tooling in house again and its a lot more viable based on the hard lessons learned from our first equipment purchase.
Legally, yes we could sue the dealer for misrepresentation but the reality is, that is three years of court costs, plus another three if there is an appeal. Most of any judgement would go to lawyer fees so its not worth the expenditure or time. I couldn't even show up to court for the government lawsuit because it costs $400 just to write a letter in defense.
Did I defraud anybody, no.
Its a business failure, not the first, not the last.
Did I make mistakes, yes.
I did the best I could with what resources where available.
All the best,
Christopher Howard
Wow, a lot of misinformation.
Railflyer Model Prototypes Inc. did not go bankrupt. It is insolvent. Under corporate law, to file bankruptcy is around $10,000 which if there was $10,000 the insolvency would have not occurred.
There have been a tremendous amount of personal attacks on me, which is libel. There was and is no fraud its just a pure and simple business failure. When there is no income, there is no business.
I did file personal bankruptcy in December, 2013. I held on as long as I could.
This was in the amount of $322,000.
It was just a series of hits I couldn't get around.
The first hit was the loss of practically all tooling we started in 2010/2011 due to the inability of the suppliers to finish the work to specification. This amounted to over 20 injection molds supporting the trucks, hoods, and associated details like the fan project.
The second hit was the concentrated online campaign against us that started in late 2011 and again in the spring of 2012. As I stated back then, yes we lost the tooling but it will be replaced. With no new orders it will take longer which is exactly what happened. 90% of the posts were in fact libel, these supposed customers had no orders outstanding.
We did purchase a new CNC from Datron Dynamics Inc. which arrived in July 2012. I was not present at the installation. It was installed by the dealer. The first signs of trouble started within a few days, within two weeks we had two electronic cards fail. After six months, there was a total of five axis driver failures, two motors failures, two interface card failures, and a control panel failure. Servicing fees without actually addressing the problem amounted to $27,000.
There was an error log pulled from the machine during the burn in at the factory which did show electrical issues at the factory, plus a serial number change. The electronics pulled from the machine ARE NOT very high quality and show signs of previous use. This was purchased as a brand new CNC and shipped direct from Germany. After setting up a number of items, we lost two drivers last August. The CNC at this point is dead. The direct purchase of the CNC was $159,000 plus the associated software, hardware for the shop etc.
The fourth and final hit was from our main lender. This was a concerted effort by them and our landlord who started denying access. I was in arrears with rent due to the loss of sales starting in 2012. By 2013, we went from the highest month of $10,000 in March 2012 to an average of $500 per month at the end. So the libel had taken a toll.
We got an eviction notice when our lease came due in September of last year. We reworked a new lease and kept everything happy but the driver fixes to the CNC proved problematic. The dealer was unwilling to replace them and because I sent them out for trouble-shooting, they would not enable us to trade them in for reused ones. The cost per driver under the exchange program is around $1200 with another fee for the core. So it was going to be around $4000 to replace the two drivers. The issue with the machine has not yet been addressed by the dealer and they refuse to do anything unless we pay the service fees. Yes the machine came with a warranty.
The main lender who is a government run community development corporation which decided to call our loans. In the process of doing this, they sued both Railflyer Model Prototypes Inc. and me.
There is a judgement against the corporation for $151,000 and myself which my bankruptcy stayed.
I was able to remove our contents of the shop including inventory. It is in a secure location waiting for the bailiff. The lender will sell the contents to recoup the loan.
With the corporation being insolvent, there is no money to do anything including ship orders.
The sad thing is normal sales in 2012/2013 would have kept things afloat as we have a significant amount of OEM work which once the CNC issues were resolved, would have more than paid for the lost production in China.
So yes, a lot of stress the past few years.
As far as addressing anything to do with Railflyer, I don't have any answers, until the lawsuit judgement is resolved, by the sale of the CNC and contents of the shop, nothing will happen.
I do know that completely rebuilding the CNC with new electronics is $46,000 just for hardware. As for the cause, I am not sure. The dealer blames electrical fluctuations but they did the installation and signed off the outlet, and this doesn't explain the evidence of electrical problems before delivery and after we rewired the shop. It is not normal to have multiple axis failures and control panel issues.
As for going forward, yes some partners and I have started a new corporation. We do have WiFi boards done, they are in firmware development at this point. It is a completely separate company, and at some point we hope to take on the obligations of our previous projects but to do that, the company has to have income.
We have floated the plans to build our own automation for doing tooling in house again and its a lot more viable based on the hard lessons learned from our first equipment purchase.
Legally, yes we could sue the dealer for misrepresentation but the reality is, that is three years of court costs, plus another three if there is an appeal. Most of any judgement would go to lawyer fees so its not worth the expenditure or time. I couldn't even show up to court for the government lawsuit because it costs $400 just to write a letter in defense.
Did I defraud anybody, no.
Its a business failure, not the first, not the last.
Did I make mistakes, yes.
I did the best I could with what resources where available.
All the best,
Christopher Howard
I have never heard of this company and have no specific info.
I will say that it's a common issue. People have an idea and they think they can sell it to fellow modelers. People who "know something about business" look at all the costs (ads, development, shipping, inventory, machines, packaging, labor, etc, etc, etc) and realize they'll probably go broke if they don't charge so much they'll never sell a product.
So you end up with the guy in his garage who has good intentions, but his business skills may be sorely lacking. Things go well for a while, then the bills pile up, or he has production issues, or he gets behind on orders. Operating on a razor thin profit to start with, it doesn't take much to tip things over.
Rarely are they out and out scammers (though that does happen) usually it's just somebody who didn't realize all the time and money that an enterprise would really take. If that's the case, they usually try to make things right.
As I said, I don't know specifics in this case, but I've seen this happen many times.
I will say that it's a common issue. People have an idea and they think they can sell it to fellow modelers. People who "know something about business" look at all the costs (ads, development, shipping, inventory, machines, packaging, labor, etc, etc, etc) and realize they'll probably go broke if they don't charge so much they'll never sell a product.
So you end up with the guy in his garage who has good intentions, but his business skills may be sorely lacking. Things go well for a while, then the bills pile up, or he has production issues, or he gets behind on orders. Operating on a razor thin profit to start with, it doesn't take much to tip things over.
Rarely are they out and out scammers (though that does happen) usually it's just somebody who didn't realize all the time and money that an enterprise would really take. If that's the case, they usually try to make things right.
As I said, I don't know specifics in this case, but I've seen this happen many times.
