Is this wide shelf layout possible


oxfordlawn

oxfordlawn

Still learning
I was searching on Modell Railroaders site for some shelf layout ideas and this one looked interesting. It shows being only 28" wide, but has a full running loop. Would a switcher and some small box or coal cars work on this small setup? Do you guys who have experience in this think If I widened it by a few to maybe 6" more that I would be able to do a raised track section along the back side---sort of as if it was cut into a hill side , instead of running thru a tunnel. I was thinking of a raised section starting on the right side turn, running along the back on a cutout from a hillside, then entering a tunnel near the rear left side and coming out the tunnel at the front left side area. Im just looking for a little input here as I thought the turns may be way too small...but if not...great
 
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2) You can do a full loop in N scale in 28" of depth. 12 or 13" radius curves is workable in N scale. 12" radius curves in N scale is the equivalent of 22" radius curves in H0 scale.

Are you in N scale, or are you asking if you can do a similar track plan in H0 scale, with 14-15" radius curves?

Smile,
Stein
 
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steinjr said:
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Are you in N scale, or are you asking if you can do a similar track plan in H0 scale, with 14-15" radius curves?

Smile,
Stein
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But Stein, if you enlarged the drawing and looked at the layout specs, you'd see it is an HO scale layout. But I believe that its Hon3 or HOn2.5,(N scale track and mechanisms), more for narrow gauge shays, climaxes and hieslers, (sp) or nohing larger than a real small diesel switcher. Mining would be my first guess and then maybe a logging RR. But there doesn't appear to be any logging facilities, that's why the mining guess.

The radius, comes out to 12" as drawn. Even for narrow gauge, this is tight. This is PDT for anything other than the steamers mentioned, or maybe a real small diesel switcher, nothing bigger than a say an 4-wheel boxcab or even a critter.
 
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Oxfordlawn, I like your idea of increasing the depth by a bit to give a larger radius and add a higher branch across the back.
 
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Cjcrescent said:
But Stein, if you enlarged the drawing and looked at the layout specs, you'd see it is an HO scale layout. But I believe that its Hon3 or HOn2.5,(N scale track and mechanisms), more for narrow gauge shays, climaxes and hieslers, (sp) or nohing larger than a real small diesel switcher. Mining would be my first guess and then maybe a logging RR. But there doesn't appear to be any logging facilities, that's why the mining guess.

The radius, comes out to 12" as drawn. Even for narrow gauge, this is tight. This is PDT for anything other than the steamers mentioned, or maybe a real small diesel switcher, nothing bigger than a say an 4-wheel boxcab or even a critter.
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Aha - couldn't open it - tried 3-4 times, but ran out of patience before the image opened in larger mode. Couldn't read the text in normal mode. Seems to work better now.

Anyways, 12" radius is not the domain of your average railroad switcher in H0 scale - an NW2 is about 6.2" long in H0 scale, and a pretty minimal 2.5x curve is about 15-16" radius.

One would have to go down to a really small switcher - say a GE 44-tonner - about 5" long in H0 scale, to get a 2.5x curve radius down to 12-12.5".

Or one can build some kind of H0 scale industrial loco on an N scale mechanism.

So you are right - this can be done with an engine and cars that are H0 scale. But it would take really small engines and cars and perfect track work to make it work well.

Smile,
Stein
 
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Now I do thank you for your input on the layout...If it is expanded to 36" and cut the radius down to say 17" would that be a little easier on the switcher and rolling stock, or is 18 really the lowest one should go?
 
bwells said:
Oxfordlawn, I like your idea of increasing the depth by a bit to give a larger radius and add a higher branch across the back.
Click to expand...

Thanks..I would like to just add a little up/down dimension instead of being all flat on the board and foam:D
 
If you could expand it to 40", you could then use 18" radius and then be able to use most 8-wheeled 1st gen diesels and 40' cars. 36" wide and 17" radius could be used if you couldn't expand to 40". With the same restriction on the diesels. Some of the plastic 2-8-0's and 2-6-0's could be used if you want steam.
 
Cjcrescent said:
If you could expand it to 40", you could then use 18" radius and then be able to use most 8-wheeled 1st gen diesels and 40' cars. 36" wide and 17" radius could be used if you couldn't expand to 40". With the same restriction on the diesels. Some of the plastic 2-8-0's and 2-6-0's could be used if you want steam.
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yeah 36" wide is definately pushing the "permission zone" of the wife in charge...so im pretty sure 40 would be right out. :eek:

So do you feel some diesel switchers and small box cars and mining coal cars will do ok on a roughly 17" radius turn??
 
One would have to go down to a really small switcher - say a GE 44-tonner - about 5" long in H0 scale, to get a 2.5x curve radius down to 12-12.5".
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what does the 2.5x number represent? ....Thats a new one for me
 
"...If you decide that your railroad is in the 40s or early 50s and you will never run passenger service, only use small steam and 4 axle first generation diesels and nothing larger than a 50' boxcar, you would be looking at Branch Line or Feeder Line service. This would allow number 5 turnouts and 16.5 radius in HO and.... "
Copyright (c) 1995-2012 National Model Railroad Association. All Rights Reserved.


Just found this info...looks like im good :)
 
oxfordlawn said:
what does the 2.5x number represent? ....Thats a new one for me
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http://www.macrodyn.com/ldsig/wiki/index.php?title=Curve_radius_rule-of-thumb

A rule of the thumb is that cars will generally track just fine through curves that have a radius radius at least 3 times (3x) the length of the longest locomotive or rolling stock used.

2x is considered really pushing it. 2.5x is a compromise for a minimum radius.

You can make some H0 scale cars and engines go through 12" radius curves. But it will possibly take modifications.

If you are limited to the space shown, and you don't already have engines etc, I would seriously consider N scale - where 28" deep is roomy enough for much larger engines and cars.

Stein
 
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scorpions_N&W said:
"dang my measurements must have been off, I can't believe I built it to 40 inches"
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Ive been looking for a while at different layouts getting ideas and that one just hit me right, having a water feature...mountains and a bit of switching. Had to practically beg to go that wide as I was originally looking at 24" max and just a switching layout....but really wanted a loop.
 
oxfordlawn said:
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So do you feel some diesel switchers and small box cars and mining coal cars will do ok on a roughly 17" radius turn??
Click to expand...

Yes I believe so, esp if you use a small steamer, then you could go to 34' and 36' cars. This would put your era back in the 20's and early 30's where these size cars were still being used on a lot of RR's. This was the era of trussrods and wooden construction.

The Roundhouse division of Athearn at Athearn.com has examples of what you can look for at train shows, e-bay, swap meets etc. While their site is showing many items as sold out, many of the former roundhouse products are still out there.

If you have to have a diesel, I would go anything bigger than the shorter, (1st gen) diesels and no cars bigger than 40 feet.
 
The Roundhouse division of Athearn at Athearn.com has examples of what you can look for at train shows, e-bay, swap meets etc. While their site is showing many items as sold out, many of the former roundhouse products are still out there.
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Thanks for the info Carey...was just poking around EBay and it seems theres still plenty of the roundhouse stuff available....the prices are reasonable but those darned shipping charges add up quick haha. Just wanted to say thanks
 
oxfordlawn said:
Thanks for the info Carey...was just poking around EBay and it seems theres still plenty of the roundhouse stuff available....the prices are reasonable but those darned shipping charges add up quick haha. Just wanted to say thanks
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You're Welcome. As to the shipping charges, I agree. Some are outrageous. But I also believe that E-bay will be, if not already, taking steps to bring a lot of that inline.
 
FWIW a Roundhouse Boxcab, with sheet lead inside the roof, and remotored/chassied with a Bachmann Underground Ernie shassis, will go round a 13.5" radius curve in HO. It doesn't like going tighter - mainly because of the available amount of bogie swing - which is going to be a limitimg factor with most locos. You might just get a bit tighter with one of the older Spectrum GE44-tonners with the twin motors as they don't have UJs to cause bogie swing problems - I siggest the 44 tonner rather than the 70-tonner, as that is a bit longer and you run into the 2.5X problem mentioned earlier. Hope that helps
 
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