Running Bear's July 2026 Coffee Shop

[kbkchooch]

Mark your calendars.

"Cyclosporiasis and you" classes start on Monday, runs til Friday!

 

[DeaconKC]

 

[DeaconKC]

Ok i need to kick up shenanagigans first is pop or soda or coke.
Next it oil comes from decaying plants and animals and plastic is made of that oil does that mean plastic dinos cam from real dinos

And next what is the rul for lays out particularly ho i have to 2.5ft by 6ft tables that i have a loop and some sidings on should i glue straight down or should i do the whole foam thing

Using Unitrack I just used latex caulk to glue the track to the foam and Woodland Scenics risers.

 

[santafewillie]

Two sad animal tales today. First, I found my culprit, or it actually found me out in the train shed. It was a kitten. Rather unnerving when it rubbed against my bare leg! So this is what has been knocking over structures and freight cars. At what I guesstimate is about 6-7 weeks, it didn't have enough bulk to tip a locomotive. I opened the door and out it scooted, fast! But it probably won't survive long if it doesn't find mama or some water soon, 2-3 days is the longest that they can normally last without a drink and it had been in the train shed for 5 days.
Second sad tale, my daughter had to put down one of my granddogs today. He could no longer stand up and was peeing all over himself. This is not Mollie who was here twice since May, but it was Bentley who was last here back in April during Spring Break.

 

[migalyto]

Its kato unitrack

Me personally I would just put a couple dabs on rack piece and call it a day. that's just painted plywood.

That's initially how I did it before I pulled it all up and went with flex track.

 

[westtexjohn]

that's the dilemma currently facing any creative endeavour.

It's a grey area, but getting through the courts. Let's take a look at a non-AI example.

When I was designing book covers using stock graphics from one of the stock photo sites, I was combining the graphics in ways the various artists had not set out to create. One book cover used an illustration (vector graphic - think "cartoon") of a woman in a business outfit. I found another graphic from the same artist with several different heads I could swap in, so I grabbed one and did the swap.

Then I found some gossamer butterfly/pixie wings. I altered the color of those, shrunk one and gave it a bit of a warp, because my character in the book had a gimpy wing. I then put those on the woman's back (as an underlay in photoshop). She also had a gimpy leg, so she used a cane for balance. Found a green and white striped candy cane vector, and added it. Found a good seaside vector graphic scene, added her (with wings and cane). Added the tubby grey cat. Added another vector of a pier silhouette. Added another vector graphic of an amusement park silhouette and set it atop the pier.

You know who was legally entitled to the copyright of that conglomeration? Me. I couldn't claim copyright of any individual piece, but I can claim copyright on the end result.

That's how courts are treating AI usage. Some European and Asian ones are granting copyright to even the person who prompts the AI for a single output. Others, like here in the US, seem to be heading toward (if not already there) that a derivitive work partially relying on work from AI can be copyrighted the human who put it all together.

Now, when I used AI to actually word the words in a book, this was right after my mother died in fall of 2024. I wasn't in the mood for any writing, but I needed to get back on the horse.

So I'd start a chapter and prompt the AI to generate words. They took a lot of editing. The more I had it write at once, the more it repeated itself. So I'd edit the AI words, turning it into my style, and that would get me going for at least double what it produced. 250 words become 750, and I heavily edited the AI's words. Then another 250 AI words, heavy editing, and continue my own words until I got stuck. rinse and repeat.

That was the only book I used AI to help write.

How do I credit the AI in that type of endeavor?

Right now, if a platform like Amazon asks if AI was used to generate words or artwork, I tell the truth on those forms. That was a "AI generated some words, heavily modified/expanded by the human" or whatever is closest to that.

I do use AI images in my book covers and marketing.

But, as for words generated by AI... only if I need a description that I can't quite get? What is the smell of a rowboat freshly pulled from an inland lake in the early fall? I don't need the sentence, just the descriptors. That sort of thing. Again, I'll heavily edit if I do have to turn to the machine to generate a description, or piece of dialogue.

For me, I use the AI as a girl/guy Friday. My own organizational skills and attention to detail can be very lacking. So I brainstorm and dump the puddles of good ideas into the AI. We converse about the book.

Today, I didn't feel like looking up what the character names for the book I was revising the plot on. I've written 1.5 books since I abandoned that work. I don't remember their names, and roles, and how I set up the bad guy's grand finale. Half that stuff would change while I write the book. But the AI remembers, and helps me fine tune my new ideas by asking questions, and forcing me to think through the plot and characters.

Again... how do I credit that? For the book I just brainstormed, I doubt that AI will write a single word.

Thanks for your time and explanation. Seems years ago before computers even, some folks used a "ghost writer" to help them. I don't think the ghost writer got any credit in those days but I could be wrong. And I think mostly ghost writers were used in biographies and autobiographies.
On another note the music industry seems to be really cracking down on AI generated material.

Take care....John

 

[westtexjohn]

Mark your calendars.

"Cyclosporiasis and you" classes start on Monday, runs til Friday!

At not quite as bad as "Chlamydia and you" classes.

Cyclosporiasis........available at Taco Bell.
Chlamydia...............available at the "Y".

John

 

[chadbag]

Using Unitrack I just used latex caulk to glue the track to the foam and Woodland Scenics risers.

I’ve been using bathroom silicone. Basically same difference. I also only spot-glue it with the silicone but it probably leads to more vibration. I need to experiment. I’m just trying to get it to not move/slide and a few dabs per piece is enough. (I’m also n scale so less mass in a locomotive).

 

[chadbag]

Regarding AI. In the U.S., AI generated stuff is not copyrightable per the copyright office. (Things can change). However significant or meaningful changes (human input) to the AI generated work can be copyrighted— but not the underlying AI output. AI prompts are not considered human input or changes. So if you generate some artwork using prompts and cut it up and rearrange it or add your own “overdub” (whatever the equivalent is in drawing or painting/illustrating) to it you can copyright your actions / additions but the underlying bits are not copyrightable.

There was a court case where a person made a comic strip and they generated the characters etc using AI. It was deemed not copyrightable. But their work to arrange the scenes into a series of scenes was copyrightable. So the actual comic images were not but the end result arrangement was. (That’s from memory from researching this subject last year so I could be a little off but it was something like that).

Using Troy as an example, if he generated some character images then they would not be copyrightable. But if he then used photoshop to mix the characters together to create a scene that scene would be. Or if he used an editor like photoshop to edit a generate character to have a different hat and maybe be in a different pose (using the editor, not the AI) he could copyright those changes.

Now, tools that use AI inside but where the human has direct control on what it’s doing (ie not prompting it but actually say selecting a piece of an image and asking it to sharpen it or to change its color or whatever— like normal tools but using AI underneath to get the effect) the AI use is probably irrelevant since the AI is not generating things itself based on prompts and the human is actually directly directing it.

IANALAIDPOOTV and I didn’t stay in a Holiday Inn Express last night so YMMV.

 

[Bill Tidler Jr.]

Good Thursday morning, Coffee Shop! It's 53°F (12°C) and clear.

Weather:
Sunny toward daybreak then becoming mostly sunny. Highs in the upper 70s. Northeast winds around 5 mph.

I can't believe these temps!

Have a great day!

 

[bnsf971]

Good morning. It's mostly clear and 77.

 

[troyphoto]

Well, howdy there internet people and those of AI origin.

It's Troy the human again. Still waiting to find out if I'm Canadian or not.

Booked with the attorney, and everything seems to take 3-5 days there. Sign the papers, make the retainer payment. 3 days later I get a "next steps" email. I do the things it asks that day. 3-5 days pass before I get a response. This last time, I waited two days, then sent a reminder email.

Good news, we slept with a fan on in the open window, drawing cool air through the upstairs. But hot and sticky is returning this weekend.

Heading out to Pizza King tonight to get my free birthday breadsticks.

Read the following only after a cup or two of coffee. It's about AI and copyright.

Regarding AI. In the U.S., AI generated stuff is not copyrightable per the copyright office. (Things can change). However significant or meaningful changes (human input) to the AI generated work can be copyrighted— but not the underlying AI output. AI prompts are not considered human input or changes. So if you generate some artwork using prompts and cut it up and rearrange it or add your own “overdub” (whatever the equivalent is in drawing or painting/illustrating) to it you can copyright your actions / additions but the underlying bits are not copyrightable.

There was a court case where a person made a comic strip and they generated the characters etc using AI. It was deemed not copyrightable. But their work to arrange the scenes into a series of scenes was copyrightable. So the actual comic images were not but the end result arrangement was. (That’s from memory from researching this subject last year so I could be a little off but it was something like that).

Using Troy as an example, if he generated some character images then they would not be copyrightable. But if he then used photoshop to mix the characters together to create a scene that scene would be. Or if he used an editor like photoshop to edit a generate character to have a different hat and maybe be in a different pose (using the editor, not the AI) he could copyright those changes.

Now, tools that use AI inside but where the human has direct control on what it’s doing (ie not prompting it but actually say selecting a piece of an image and asking it to sharpen it or to change its color or whatever— like normal tools but using AI underneath to get the effect) the AI use is probably irrelevant since the AI is not generating things itself based on prompts and the human is actually directly directing it.

IANALAIDPOOTV and I didn’t stay in a Holiday Inn Express last night so YMMV.

Chad did a good job summarizing. But there are some additional conditions/situations world-wide.

For the record, I asked the AI in Brave Browser what the Copyright conditions were world wide for AI. It sounded right, but... so I gave it's output to Claude and watched what links it was pulling in to generate it's answer. There were a lot of court cases and government docs in that list. Below is what Claude says about Copyrighting AI and derivitive works based on AI output.

TLR summary of the follow:
1. The US will copyright the human side of a derivative work. Case in point, my book covers. I typically get at least two or more images, mesh them together, add typography for the title etc. That is copyrightable. The individual pics from the AI, not so.

2. UK and Ireland are most permissive. Some countries are allowing some copyright of AI output if there is substantive prompting behind it.

3. it differs from Country to Country. Most require human input beyond just prompting.

4. The US copyright office issued a report about it. Generative works alone are not enough, but the human produced parts, even in combining elements are. (see the part about my book covers)

Here's what Claude said about the mess: (double check any links included. I haven't chased them down after watching the AI pull them up the first time as it built it's report).

• US: The Supreme Court declined to hear Thaler v. Perlmutter on March 2, 2026, leaving standing the 2025 DC Circuit opinion affirming the Copyright Office's requirement of human authorship. Purely autonomous AI output still can't be registered. Mayer Brown
• UK & Ireland: Both countries assign authorship of computer-generated works to "the person who undertakes the necessary arrangements for the creation of the work" — no requirement that a human directly created the expressive content, just that they set up the process. Cambridge Core
• China: Chinese courts have recognized copyright in AI-generated images where extensive prompt selection and subsequent editing constituted sufficient personalized human expression — the well-known Li v. Liu case is the reference point here. arxiv
• Ukraine: It's a genuinely distinctive setup. Article 33 of Ukraine's Copyright and Related Rights law defines a "non-original object generated by a computer program" as one produced without direct involvement of a natural person, and grants sui generis rights (not full copyright) to whoever initiated, funded, or holds rights to the software. Ukraine has actually started issuing registrations under this — a children's book and poetry collection with AI illustrations were among the first. AIPPI
• EU (ex-Ireland): Human creative contribution is still the standard, though it's being tested. A German first-instance court in 2026 dealt with AI-generated logos along similar lines to earlier Czech and Italian decisions, treating AI as a tool a human can create through rather than a bar to protection. Lexology
• Japan. The framing that Japan is unusually permissive isn't quite right. Japan uses essentially the same human-creative-contribution test as everyone else, not a more lenient collaboration-friendly standard. The critical element is human creative contribution — a work must originate from a natural person's intellectual effort, and algorithmic processing alone, however sophisticated, doesn't satisfy this. If a user types a generic prompt and the model produces the entire work autonomously, the output is unlikely to qualify for copyright. So Japan actually belongs in the "most jurisdictions" bucket with the US and China's baseline rule, not off on its own as a separate lenient category — the AI multiple/aimultiple summary even notes Japan's permissive framework applies mainly to training (fair use for AI training), which is a different question from output copyrightability. Global Law ExpertsAIMultiple

It's really two camps — (1) US/EU/Japan/China all requiring demonstrable human creative contribution (differing mainly in how much documentation/evidence courts expect), and (2) UK/Ireland/NZ/Hong Kong/India using the "necessary arrangements" authorship model that doesn't require creative input at all. Ukraine's sui generis carve-out is the real outlier, a third category that doesn't call it copyright at all.

 

[ctclibby]

Good Morning All!
63F @ 56% looks like it is gonna be clear and HOT .. again.

Not much is getting done outside these days - can get in a hour or so at most, then ima done.

In the last month or 2, I have seen me as the only user quite a few times. Have been a member since 2010 and do not remember ever seeing that before. Are we loosing members? Hope not. Bob?

@santafewillie Better having a kitten give ya a scare vs a bat crawling up the inside of you pant leg....

L8r

 

[TLOC]

Sophia or Raquel?

Sophia

and

between Ginger and Maryann

MaryAnn

 

[migalyto]

Good morning all!

Going to be another nice Midwest day today. Currently a cool 53F. The high is going to reach around 77F under mostly sunny skies. A couple
of degrees warmer than yesterday. Looks like this will continue thru Saturday when the heat starts to build again. Been nice sleeping with the
windows open.

Usual stuff around the house this morning

Later this afternoon we have a volleyball league game that is about an hour away. We have 2 more next week then its done thank goodness!

Not much else going on at the moment. That's a good thing!

Have a safe day everyone!

 

[TLOC]

Good morning to all! 6 humans and 534 of our bot friends. 52f degrees now and 75 maybe with calm winds. Yesterday only got up to 73 but the breezes were steady in the teens. The gusts were nasty sometimes reaching 36mph. The AQI yesterday stayed in the 20’s today though is already higher at 30 than anytime in the last 36 hours.

I hung some artwork yesterday after having to go to the warehouse and open up one of the storage pods. Terry had me pull 5 paintings one of which surprisingly is mine. I WILL take a photo and post it later when it’s a bit brighter in here.

I’d say we are comfortably moved in but I know she ordered new towels for my bathroom! A 12’x16’ area rug for the open kitchen, living room and dining room space. She “wanted” to define the living area versus the dining area! Let her enjoy it. My issue with this place is I don’t have a get away space without going next door to my work space. I need a place away from the TV and it’s not here. She does have an idea though which maybe $$$ scary but hasn’t told me yet!

For day 3 of the mosquito experiment we went over to the site the girls have chosen for the next project or rather house! No mosquitos bothered us and she was thrilled. Well, the winds were blowing in the teens keeping those biters away. Did a search last weekend about mosquitos repellants and besides thermacells and evil killing chemicals the search said mosquitos have trouble flying in winds over 3 mph and suggested area fans. I just don’t think this site is going to work for as much as we both prefer to be outdoors in Summer like weather. I ordered thermacells off of the Amazon Tuesday for delivery Saturday to continue the mosquito experiment roughly 500’ from a designated protected wetlands.

Hair cut at 9

Willie is the kitten mostly a barn cat though your barn is down or from a neighbor?

The daughter and family are gone for the weekend. They will be back Monday after visiting their place in Wisconsin’s beautiful Door County. This one is a story I still can’t believe the daughter and SIL fell for! But for another day…

Enjoy your day

 

[RhB Michael]

Tastes great, or less filling?

I remember my first beer...

 

[DeaconKC]

Good morning folks and an unbelievable 68 degrees this morning! Only supposed to hit 85 today, which is good as we have guys coming in to do one of those 2 day bathroom renovations today. Actually it is only a new shower, but that will be nice.
@chadbag I don't even let silicone caulk near the layout because of it's resistance to take paint. But I'm chicken so there is that to consider.
@santafewillie I believe you it was a surprise! That would have woke me right up too!
Well you guys have a great day.

 

[RhB Michael]

Good morning. 62°F/62°F this morning. Doesn't feel like 100% humidity. Like a taste of early Autumn this morning.

A summer reminder will be back on Sunday though, with a high of 95°F. Who knows what the DP will be. High, I would imagine. High for today of 78°F locally, STL is still forecasting 82°F. Rain tomorrow and 76°F before the heat comes back Sunday.

Grilling hamburgers this afternoon and washed down with a Bitburger later on.

Have a great Thursday. It's the Autumn pre-show here today.

Servus!

 

[santafewillie]

Good Morning All. Clear and 77°. The ever evolving weather forecast now calls for a high today and tomorrow in the upper-90's, after just barely reaching 100° yesterday; 4° below the predicted high. Still better than the 110° reached on Tuesday. Other than hot and dry, no real change except in the daily temperature range.

Interesting ongoing discussion regarding AI/copyright issues. I'll probably never need any of it, but it has been very informative.

While it wasn't as hot yesterday as it was on Tuesday, it was still hot enough to limit my outdoor activity. My tolerance for the heat has been reduced in the past few years. Pool was still refreshing though.
Today is the usual weekly grocery trek, plus the dishwasher awaits me.

I made two separate forays out to the train shed yesterday, hoping to find my intruder. Finally did just as I was leaving on the second round. Otherwise I cleaned the last few structures in the cleaning project area and uprighted some structures elsewhere, where the now known kitten had knocked them over. Since I have been cleaning vehicles as I went along, there isn't much left to do on the layout cleaning project. I also rotated some freight cars around in some of the unit freights in the staging yards. Those that are run from one end of the layout to the other, when I don't feel like switching. It's about the only time that I actually handle them.
What's next??? I haven't even thought about it yet. I do need to go back and stripe the roads that I showed a few weeks ago. And there's a single ground throw from the previous project.

Troy - Just my opinion, but I wouldn't even bother with the #8 turnouts on a layout of your size. I have had plenty of success with just using #6's. And I run a lot of long intermodal equipment and flats.
Todd - Several times recently I have logged in and been the only member listed; the most recent being earlier today around 0630 CDT. I do believe that we are losing members though. Mostly newer members who have become frustrated with the database errors and other nonsense.
Tom O -

Willie is the kitten mostly a barn cat though your barn is down or from a neighbor?

I believe that it is a barn cat from my barn, as the only neighbor with cats (Bubba's wife), lives a quarter mile away and her cats are indoor ones. That quarter mile away is a hayfield with 5' Johnson Grass growing in it.

The late Dino Danelli, drummer with The Rascals (The Young Rascals), was born on this day in 1944. The late one hit wonder Tony Joe White (Polk Salad Annie) was born in 1947.

Everyone have a great Thursday.