Running Bear's February 2022 Coffee Shop

[MilwRoader_Steve]

Just to point out that your actual taxes are computed at the end of the year. Their automated pay systems will take out extra because you slipped over a line into a higher bracket, but because it is only once in a while that you work overtime it doesn't really push you into the higher bracket and you will get more of it back when you file.

My wife sometimes gets hung up with this as well. When they withhold more, that doesn't necessarily means you are paying that extra in taxes. That is just their algorithm for predicting your taxes and doing withholding. Your final tax paid is based on your actual tax rate. Say your actual rate is 15% (plus approx 9% in SS and Medicare). So 24%. Plus say 6% state tax for 30%. If your overtime brings your $15 hour up to $22.50 an hour, and you work 5 hours, your gross would be $112.50 and your actual net of taxes is $78.75. But you may not realize that until you file and get the extra back. The withholding algorithms are usually way wrong when dealing with occasional blips in your income (that does not greatly change the end of year income) so while you may not get more than $30 in your paycheck, you will get the rest when you file taxes.

Yes, biggest gripe session comes when she gets a bonus. Bonuses are automatically subject to, I think, a 48% withholding. In other words, earn a $1K bonus, and receive less than $600. On a $5K bonus she brings home not much more than $2K (FICA, MC, State ...)

Then there's me - - - lowly, humble pastor dude. Say I do a funeral for Aunt Edna. The family wishes to do a little something for me for the extra work and time put in for them. So they give me $100. Nice. I get $48 of it. Uncle Joe and Gov. Kim Jung Walz get the rest. So I have taken to telling people, especially the ones I know well. I would much rather have the equivalent in single-malt Scotch. Don't have to declare that. Sometimes they say, "We don't know what to get, here's a gift Card." Uncle Joe and Gov. Walz rub their hands in greedy ecstasy because now I have to pay taxes on the full $100, but I don't get any cash to do so - can only spend it for goods in the store, unless I sell it.

Trust me, I am not a conspiracy guy (no tin foil hat), but rumour is that the tax=prep industry lobbies congress HARD to keep our system so convoluted. I am inclined to believe this - not because of conspiracy, but because money talks BIG in DC and state capitals.

 

[Espeefan]

Willie: You are truly a fortunate man. I'm used to crowded conditions, growing up in a city, then living in subdivisions with smaller lots. I'm also used to a diversity of political views and expectations...What I never dealt with before is outright in your face resentment and self importance that has been common here since we moved from Metro Baltimore.

Interesting. Where did you move to? If you don't mind my asking, what sort of resentment? Rural folk not liking city folk? Something else?

 

[chadbag]

YSo they give me $100. Nice. I get $48 of it.

No. You get your normal tax rate on this. It may be withheld at a higher rate if you have withholding (I don't know how it works in your line of business but for wage earners and salaried employees who get a W2 and have withholding this is true). So you may only get $48 or whatever up front. But when you file it will even out as the actual tax rate applied is your normal tax rate.

 

[PRR Modeler]

Afternoon All,

Did a couple of chores then made a trip to Wally World. Of course, they were out of foamboard, and I didn't have the energy to go to Jo-Ann's today. In the train room I cut back the service rail (for the build) about 4 inches. This will allow me to bring the road through that space instead of across the rails. I prepped the area and drilled out the lighting wire holes. After that I cleaned up the work bench area and removed the long table that I had been using for kit parts.

Thank you for all the photo likes yesterday.

Gary- Love the color on the 4-6-4. I did something similar on my first layout and kept it but had constant steamer issues on that section of track. Very frustrating. You made the right decision.

Chet- Thank you. Nice looking condo.

George- We have vinyl planks on the entire upstairs and we love the flooring.

Joe- You bring up valid points. The more "freebies" that the government passes out the more the productive part of society has to pay to cover them.

Terry- Interesting video.

Tom- Best wishes on your surgery.

Willie- Great scenes. I forgot to mention yesterday my favorite was the donut eating police officer.

Patrick- Nice haul.

James- Really cool crane.

I hope everyone has a good night.

 

[chadbag]

Taxes - If everyone paid their fair share it probably wouldn't be so bad. However, those 1%-ers work at figuring ways nor to pay or at least pay a minimum in taxes. Big corporations do the same, paying folks to figure ways to beat the system.

I'd like to point out that the top 10% pay 71% of all income taxes and the top 25% pay 87% of all income taxes. (Which BTW is higher than it was in Obama -- the previous presidents tax changes were progressive)

If anyone is not paying their fair share, it is the bottom half.

Personally, I think EVERYONE should have to pay some sort of income tax (even if they only make minimum wage). Everyone should have skin in the game. (I personally think that anyone who does not pay at least $100 in taxes AFTER any credits are applied shouldn't get to vote in the next election -- those with no skin in the game shouldn't get to vote on how that game is played/money spent).

 

[OBTC 1909]

Good afternoon all! Didn't make it in here this morning so I'm stopping in for a quick message now. Got up early and took my youngest granddaughter to school, then had to run a couple other errands. Nothing much to report otherwise. Hope you all have a great day!

 

[Bruette]

Chad I'm with you, everyone should pay tax. That is why I'm in favor of a flat tax, regardless of income.

However I draw the line at any restriction to voting rights. What's next only land owners vote? As things are we are already beginning to looking like England during the industrial revolution for our workers.

 

[Alcomotive]

James this is a beautiful car. What detail. Tie unloader, right? I know because this was the last job I worked on before leaving the railroad. Unloading ties for the conversion to 3rd rail electrification of the Harlem Division, Penn Central.
George

Correct!

 

[Alcomotive]

Discussing taxes is a nice pass time. Just like the weather, nobody is going to be able to effect change.
That tie unloader. I'm pretty sure it's HO but the couplers on the gondola suggest O scale.

All HO.....

 

[NYC_George]

Correct!

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Who's layout?

 

[Espeefan]

How many of us here watch the news for information about investing/retirement funding?

I do. I'm old enough to go now, but I'm waiting until the wife is old enough to get on Medicare. I've been doing a bunch of research. Shocking when you find out how many haven't saved enough.

 

[chadbag]

Chad I'm with you, everyone should pay tax. That is why I'm in favor of a flat tax, regardless of income.

However I draw the line at any restriction to voting rights. What's next only land owners vote? As things are we are already beginning to looking like England during the industrial revolution for our workers.

My ideas have ZERO chance of passing, but voting is privilege and those who don't put into the system shouldn't be able to vote to get from the system. You enshrine this in the Constitution, so as to make willy nilly changes and updates to it at the whim of Congress a lot harder, which is how you "fix" your objection.

 

[chadbag]

I'd like to point out that the top 10% pay 71% of all income taxes and the top 25% pay 87% of all income taxes. (Which BTW is higher than it was in Obama -- the previous presidents tax changes were progressive)

If anyone is not paying their fair share, it is the bottom half.

Just some supporting data:

Who Pays Income Taxes?

(PDF) updated April 2026 In 2025, Congress locked in key provisions of the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act through the One Big Beautiful Bill Act. Yet, debates over the tax code rage on. Calls for new wealth taxes and higher rates on top earners have intensified, as the federal government continues to...

www.ntu.org

Summary of the Latest Federal Income Tax Data, Tax Year 2022

New IRS data shows the US federal income tax system continues to be progressive as high-income taxpayers pay the highest average income tax rates. Average tax rates for all income groups remain lower after the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act (TCJA).

taxfoundation.org

In 1 Chart, How Much the Rich Pay in Taxes

Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-MA) holds a news conference to announce legislation that would tax the net worth of America's wealthiest individuals at the U.S. Capitol on March 01, 2021 in Washington, D.C.

www.heritage.org

 

[Alcomotive]

Who's layout?

The guy I am buying from Justin at OTM Tracker.

Facebook

www.facebook.com

 

[Espeefan]

I'd like to point out that the top 10% pay 71% of all income taxes and the top 25% pay 87% of all income taxes. (Which BTW is higher than it was in Obama -- the previous presidents tax changes were progressive)

If anyone is not paying their fair share, it is the bottom half.

Personally, I think EVERYONE should have to pay some sort of income tax (even if they only make minimum wage). Everyone should have skin in the game. (I personally think that anyone who does not pay at least $100 in taxes AFTER any credits are applied shouldn't get to vote in the next election -- those with no skin in the game shouldn't get to vote on how that game is played/money spent).

Well, actually everyone pays some taxes. if you don't make enough to pay federal, you still pay state taxes, sales taxes, etc, and so on. As for the top earners paying most of the income taxes, well, when you make most of the money, you pay most of the taxes. That's not persecution, it's mathematics. If a large portion of the population doesn't make enough to pay federal taxes, your problem is that they aren't making enough money, not that they're getting any sort of break. Look where the last round of tax cuts went. Mostly to the top, which are permanent, and everyone else got a few crumbs from the table which will sunset in a few years. As for tying it to voting, no, we don't want to go back to feudalism, thanks anyway.

 

[chadbag]

Well, actually everyone pays some taxes. if you don't make enough to pay federal, you still pay state taxes, sales taxes, etc, and so on. As for the top earners paying most of the income taxes, well, when you make most of the money, you pay most of the taxes. That's not persecution, it's mathematics. If a large portion of the population doesn't make enough to pay federal taxes, your problem is that they aren't making enough money, not that they're getting any sort of break. Look where the last round of tax cuts went. Mostly to the top, which are permanent, and everyone else got a few crumbs from the table which will sunset in a few years. As for tying it to voting, no, we don't want to go back to feudalism, thanks anyway.

It is not mathematics The top 1% earn 21% of income but pay 40% of all taxes. The top 2-5% earn 16% of all income but pay 20% of all taxes (speaking of federal income tax). It is not merely a case of those who earn more pay more (which would be obvious).

Everyone should pay a minimum federal income tax if they have income. AFTER credits. The problem is that they don't pay because of credits applied (EIC etc). And their rate is much lower as well.

 

[chadbag]

Look where the last round of tax cuts went. Mostly to the top, which are permanent, and everyone else got a few crumbs from the table which will sunset in a few years. As for tying it to voting, no, we don't want to go back to feudalism, thanks anyway.

Actually, this is not true. The percentage of tax paid by the top went UP. The former presidents "tax cuts" were progressive and shifted the tax burden up. This is fact based on several years of tax data.

 

[Espeefan]

Actually, this is not true. The percentage of tax paid by the top went UP. The former presidents "tax cuts" were progressive and shifted the tax burden up. This is fact based on several years of tax data.

Well that sort of follows, don't you think, since they got a hell of a lot richer through the process. You have to look at the whole picture which includes where the money is going. https://www.thebalance.com/income-inequality-in-america-3306190

 

[NYC_George]

Correct!

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I sent the photo to my friend. That's what he did on the railroad track machine operator. He'll buy that in a flash.
George

 

[chadbag]

Well that sort of follows, don't you think, since they got a hell of a lot richer through the process. You have to look at the whole picture which includes where the money is going. https://www.thebalance.com/income-inequality-in-america-3306190

Actually it doesn't follow. The top 1% (at least comparing 2017 and 2018) actually captured less of the income of the country in 2018 vs 2017 yet their share of taxes went up. In 2019 their share of the income fell again (and their share of the taxes also went down a little).

(Tax data is always a couple years behind in being available).