Running Bear's December 2025 Coffee Shop
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Thanks for the information regarding being able to import stuff into Chrome. Now, maybe after the first of the year sometime, I'll make the jump to Win11 and start over again.
I downloaded that sheet music and learned it on piano this year. I've been playing it on guitar for the last few years. It's one of my most favorite Christmas tunes and is played all the time on German radio. Not so much here.
L8r
I have copied and pasted, used the insert photo icon at the top, and even pulled them directly out of my photo library and have
never had the rotation problem.
Apple devices and I assume other modern devices with fancy cameras and stuff do not store the data in that order because when held sideways or upside down the sensors output the data in a way that is not "right side up" so that they detect orientation and add it to the meta data so that the display tech knows how to orient the image for display. That's my interpretation of what is happening from a user perspective but also because I had to deal with it in an app I was helping develop -- we took pictures and if we ignored the meta data we would get upside-down or sideways pics.
To rephrase what I said above -- the sensor in the camera dumps the data to the operating system based on the sensor's default orientation. That default orientation of the sensor may not always be "right side up" for whatever reason (the way the sensor is mounted in the phone/camera, the user holding the phone sideways or upside down*, etc). For performance reasons the phone doesn't move the data around to be right-side up -- if its doing a quick multi-picture burst mode and getting multiple 12 MP or 48 MP dumped all on it in a second or two it can't take the time to rotate that 12 MP or 48 MP image around in memory before storing it. The data is dumped from the sensor to storage. By attaching an orientation meta-data tag to it, the display software can orient it correctly on-screen -- changing the data for only one picture instead of a whole ton of pictures like the camera would have to do. Again, this is my understanding from observing it as a user and also from the software engineer side of interfacing with the camera in an app.
Based on my experience it seems that when you "export" a photo from an iPhone or iPad or Mac into a file, it re-orients and writes the data to the file system in traditional order (right side up). In other words, it looks at the meta data and fixes it on the export. (I can't say I've written a file from my phone or iPad into a JPG on a shared disk but I do export images from the Photo Library that is common between all my devices from my Mac into a file. When I do that the images aren't upside down). When posting directly from the iPhone or iPad, taking the photo out of the photo library, it sends the data the way the camera took it with the meta data for orientation.
* while most people won't purposefully hold their phone upside down to take a picture, if you are taking pictures of stuff on a table from above, you'd be surprised how often the phone tilts to being "upside down" by being tilted slightly lower on the far side... That's the issue I ran into when I was interfacing with a camera in our app.
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In other news, the decoder for the supposed decoder-equipped engine is out for delivery. It was $1.50 more to buy and get it shipped than driving an hour and a half to the hobby shop. I’m sure I would also have found something else to buy while I was there, so this is the economical choice..
RhB Michael
RhB Lokführer
Good morning! 33°F now, heading for 50°F today with a climb to the 70°s by Christmas.
Nephew coming by today for Christmas since he has to work Christmas Eve and Day.
Apple pie in the oven as I write. Have a great day! Servus!
Nephew coming by today for Christmas since he has to work Christmas Eve and Day.
Apple pie in the oven as I write. Have a great day! Servus!
migalyto
Well-Known Member
Good morning all!
Fairly nice day in store and it will be a bit above average for this time of year. Currently 33F with an expected high of 41F. Looking
outside, it appears the sun is out but clouds will start to build later.
Already made a bank run this morning to get crisp bills for the money holders. Looks like the wife already has a list of chores for us
to accomplish this morning. Wrapping presents will be the big item, and she want to put some more decorations out around the house
since we are hosting the big Christmas eve get together for her side. Im sure she is not going to let me sit idle much this morning since
she is off work and does not have that to keep her occupied.
We shall see what else the day brings.
Have a safe day everyone!
Fairly nice day in store and it will be a bit above average for this time of year. Currently 33F with an expected high of 41F. Looking
outside, it appears the sun is out but clouds will start to build later.
Already made a bank run this morning to get crisp bills for the money holders. Looks like the wife already has a list of chores for us
to accomplish this morning. Wrapping presents will be the big item, and she want to put some more decorations out around the house
since we are hosting the big Christmas eve get together for her side. Im sure she is not going to let me sit idle much this morning since
she is off work and does not have that to keep her occupied.
We shall see what else the day brings.
Have a safe day everyone!
TLOC
Well-Known Member
Good morning to all and to all the medical users of CA and be glad the doctors used syringes to apply the glue to your chest. Never fun hauling a set of struck fingers. Last week when I cut my thumb open with the Exacto blade after cleaning I used my medical tube of CA I get from my wife’s doctor friend. We were out to dinner one night and she asked years ago why my fingers were bandaged? I explained I get clumsy occasionally with the Exacto blade and being on blood thinners I bleed forever. Told her I close the wound with CA. I thought she was going into shock or a heart attack. That’s not safe she mention and I said been doing for years. Next day I got a vial of medical CA and now I get one every Xmas for at least the last 6 years. No difference from what I can tell
Well the weather in Wisconsin is, nice! 32f degrees now feels like 24 but heading to 38. The Sun that was supposed to shine is lost as it’s pretty overcast out there. Took the garbage and recycling bins out at 6:30 and it was 24 and it felt good. I don’t miss the biting wind chills of the past 5 days.
The son and girlfriend are here and Sunday saw no activity in the train room. But over in the daughter’s workshop the son and I were working on building the frames for him to take home for a slot car track. The frames are on legs and standing in her shop. Today we will apply cookie cutting style the 3/4’ birch board that will make up the track that will need the slots routed. Unfortunately the place I have purchased 3/4” x 48” x 96” birch now only has 48”x48” sheet. We will try to optimize the sheets I still have to my best ability before we head out to buy more at $65.00 a sheet! The daughter has 1 full sheet left she said we can take. We have to get the wood cut, set in place and look at it. If he likes it we will glue it and screw it. The joins are done with biscuits, glue and clamps. Lots of clamps. I did tell him to bring whatever clamps he had and he did but with mine and the daughter’s it still may not be enough. He is up and getting ready. By noon I hope to be done with the cutting, gluing and clamping. If all is good we can route the slots on Wednesday and with the daughter helping with a second router it should be quick. I have plenty of new bits purchased a few weeks ago. When he leaves he will leave without pit lanes. The transitions from 3 slots to a pit lane in and then out is complicated. He will leave with 2 temporary sections he can pull out when I finally get the pit lanes completed.
The grandson is home today for Christmas break and his friends will be over to help starting at 10. He wants a new track but the cost of the birch has delayed his wish. But he wants to learn as do his friends so they can glue, insert biscuits and clamp. They will also man the vacuums on the routers that fill up fast. I will give them a chance on the routers as their parents or grandparents have said yes.
This track will be built to handle 1/32 scale slot cars. He wanted 1/24 but the track spacing is wider as are the shoulders making the track 15” wide vs the 12” wide to fit 1/32 scale. It’s a compromise he will live with because of space limitations. He can still run 1/24 but 3 cars together will be tight. It’s why you have switching lane capabilities with digital.
It’s going to be a full day here
Enjoy your day
Well the weather in Wisconsin is, nice! 32f degrees now feels like 24 but heading to 38. The Sun that was supposed to shine is lost as it’s pretty overcast out there. Took the garbage and recycling bins out at 6:30 and it was 24 and it felt good. I don’t miss the biting wind chills of the past 5 days.
The son and girlfriend are here and Sunday saw no activity in the train room. But over in the daughter’s workshop the son and I were working on building the frames for him to take home for a slot car track. The frames are on legs and standing in her shop. Today we will apply cookie cutting style the 3/4’ birch board that will make up the track that will need the slots routed. Unfortunately the place I have purchased 3/4” x 48” x 96” birch now only has 48”x48” sheet. We will try to optimize the sheets I still have to my best ability before we head out to buy more at $65.00 a sheet! The daughter has 1 full sheet left she said we can take. We have to get the wood cut, set in place and look at it. If he likes it we will glue it and screw it. The joins are done with biscuits, glue and clamps. Lots of clamps. I did tell him to bring whatever clamps he had and he did but with mine and the daughter’s it still may not be enough. He is up and getting ready. By noon I hope to be done with the cutting, gluing and clamping. If all is good we can route the slots on Wednesday and with the daughter helping with a second router it should be quick. I have plenty of new bits purchased a few weeks ago. When he leaves he will leave without pit lanes. The transitions from 3 slots to a pit lane in and then out is complicated. He will leave with 2 temporary sections he can pull out when I finally get the pit lanes completed.
The grandson is home today for Christmas break and his friends will be over to help starting at 10. He wants a new track but the cost of the birch has delayed his wish. But he wants to learn as do his friends so they can glue, insert biscuits and clamp. They will also man the vacuums on the routers that fill up fast. I will give them a chance on the routers as their parents or grandparents have said yes.
This track will be built to handle 1/32 scale slot cars. He wanted 1/24 but the track spacing is wider as are the shoulders making the track 15” wide vs the 12” wide to fit 1/32 scale. It’s a compromise he will live with because of space limitations. He can still run 1/24 but 3 cars together will be tight. It’s why you have switching lane capabilities with digital.
It’s going to be a full day here
Enjoy your day
chadbag
Well-Known Member
Except the cost. (You get yours at Christmas but if it were on an insurance bill I’m sure it be 10x what you pay at the hobby shop).
santafewillie
Same Ol' Buzzard
Well, just as I was about to import them, I decided to just download Firefox again and try over. It worked and I am now a happy surfer.
Thanks for the information regarding being able to import stuff into Chrome. Now, maybe after the first of the year sometime, I'll make the jump to Win11 and start over again.
ctclibby
Well-Known Member
Good Morning All!
32F @ 85%. Have bout 4" of white on the ground. 4" - 7" more with winter advisory.
Days are getting longer but that probably won't matter for a month or three.
So, cutting Gussets is now waiting - too much smoke from the laser. Even stopped the 1st print. Need to put a range hood or something to vent to the outside. And that is on the small bed laser. Knew I would have to vent the CO2, so I guess that all of them will get treatment.
FYI - some of the other forums are ( still ) having problems with sideways images. Looks like IPhones and Tablets are the major cause. Don't know if y'all care or not. Seems with this site, everybody has gotten it down to a science. Also, TB is now using Cloudfare to keep the 'bots out. What a PITA and on top of that, users are jumping ship at a pretty good rate.
Ya, probably doing a shopping stint. Roads look to be pretty good, so just we will keep it slow if so.
L8r
32F @ 85%. Have bout 4" of white on the ground. 4" - 7" more with winter advisory.
Days are getting longer but that probably won't matter for a month or three.
So, cutting Gussets is now waiting - too much smoke from the laser. Even stopped the 1st print. Need to put a range hood or something to vent to the outside. And that is on the small bed laser. Knew I would have to vent the CO2, so I guess that all of them will get treatment.
FYI - some of the other forums are ( still ) having problems with sideways images. Looks like IPhones and Tablets are the major cause. Don't know if y'all care or not. Seems with this site, everybody has gotten it down to a science. Also, TB is now using Cloudfare to keep the 'bots out. What a PITA and on top of that, users are jumping ship at a pretty good rate.
Ya, probably doing a shopping stint. Roads look to be pretty good, so just we will keep it slow if so.
L8r
chadbag
Well-Known Member
The problem is that the forum software disregards the orientation meta data.
RhB Michael
RhB Lokführer
I downloaded that sheet music and learned it on piano this year. I've been playing it on guitar for the last few years. It's one of my most favorite Christmas tunes and is played all the time on German radio. Not so much here.
Bruette
Well-Known Member
Good afternoon, Everyone!
I've been back to work for the last couple of days. I guess I’m feeling better, though it’s hard to tell since I usually feel pretty lousy anyway.
I do know my energy level is seriously lacking. I did manage to cobble together a train under the living room Christmas tree.
I robbed the family room Christmas layout of a half dozen cars and I had a Christmas locomotive handy. It is certainly not a train I would have planned to use, but I love it! As I like to say "It is better to be lucky than good" God wiling I will soon have some photos to share in my Christmas thread and maybe even a video.
Merry Christmas Everyone!
I've been back to work for the last couple of days. I guess I’m feeling better, though it’s hard to tell since I usually feel pretty lousy anyway.
I do know my energy level is seriously lacking. I did manage to cobble together a train under the living room Christmas tree.
I robbed the family room Christmas layout of a half dozen cars and I had a Christmas locomotive handy. It is certainly not a train I would have planned to use, but I love it! As I like to say "It is better to be lucky than good" God wiling I will soon have some photos to share in my Christmas thread and maybe even a video. Merry Christmas Everyone!
ctclibby
Well-Known Member
Chad If that is the problem, why do all my images show up proper? Well, that could be how I go about posting an image. I use the 'scenery' image in the menu, drag and drop. Think that Willie does a copy and paste, I don't remember if any of his have been ..um.. sideways. I do not use a phone or tablet so don't know about those, nor do I need to find out.
L8r
I just drag and drop also.
migalyto
Well-Known Member
Its kind of weird how some have the issue and some don't.
I have copied and pasted, used the insert photo icon at the top, and even pulled them directly out of my photo library and have
never had the rotation problem.
chadbag
Well-Known Member
Because the orientation meta data is optional and so your images may not have any orientation meta data. The forum software assumes that the data for the image is always right side up (probably starting from the upper left). This is a WAG but I assume in the old days that JPG did not have orientation meta data -- speaking 20 years ago etc. And a lot of software probably assumes that still.
Apple devices and I assume other modern devices with fancy cameras and stuff do not store the data in that order because when held sideways or upside down the sensors output the data in a way that is not "right side up" so that they detect orientation and add it to the meta data so that the display tech knows how to orient the image for display. That's my interpretation of what is happening from a user perspective but also because I had to deal with it in an app I was helping develop -- we took pictures and if we ignored the meta data we would get upside-down or sideways pics.
To rephrase what I said above -- the sensor in the camera dumps the data to the operating system based on the sensor's default orientation. That default orientation of the sensor may not always be "right side up" for whatever reason (the way the sensor is mounted in the phone/camera, the user holding the phone sideways or upside down*, etc). For performance reasons the phone doesn't move the data around to be right-side up -- if its doing a quick multi-picture burst mode and getting multiple 12 MP or 48 MP dumped all on it in a second or two it can't take the time to rotate that 12 MP or 48 MP image around in memory before storing it. The data is dumped from the sensor to storage. By attaching an orientation meta-data tag to it, the display software can orient it correctly on-screen -- changing the data for only one picture instead of a whole ton of pictures like the camera would have to do. Again, this is my understanding from observing it as a user and also from the software engineer side of interfacing with the camera in an app.
Based on my experience it seems that when you "export" a photo from an iPhone or iPad or Mac into a file, it re-orients and writes the data to the file system in traditional order (right side up). In other words, it looks at the meta data and fixes it on the export. (I can't say I've written a file from my phone or iPad into a JPG on a shared disk but I do export images from the Photo Library that is common between all my devices from my Mac into a file. When I do that the images aren't upside down). When posting directly from the iPhone or iPad, taking the photo out of the photo library, it sends the data the way the camera took it with the meta data for orientation.
* while most people won't purposefully hold their phone upside down to take a picture, if you are taking pictures of stuff on a table from above, you'd be surprised how often the phone tilts to being "upside down" by being tilted slightly lower on the far side... That's the issue I ran into when I was interfacing with a camera in our app.
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kbkchooch
Verified Human
Sorry you wasted your money Mike, but the winning ticket is hanging on my refrigerator door!!!On my way home from running some errands I purchased what I hope is the winning $1.6BN Powerball ticket.
santafewillie
Same Ol' Buzzard
You're correct Todd. I copy and paste. never had a sideways picture.
santafewillie
Same Ol' Buzzard
I already won the $2 that I didn't spend!Sorry you wasted your money Mike, but the winning ticket is hanging on my refrigerator door!!!
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