Weathering Rolling Stock, a Continous thread

[C&OMtnMan]

Thank you for sharing. That is definitely in the spirit that I started this thread. Great work and great explaining your process.

I have done a handful of N scale commissions and they are IMO tougher to do then HO. Your pictures are fine, especially the last one that shows the texturing on the side panels.

TomO

Thank you, TomO!

My next batch is early in the making (initial Dullcote only). I’m think of fashioning a tool to aid in making more varied vertical rust streaks:

A little piece of wood cut to fit in the space between ribs. Cut one end of it to be essentially a three-prong fork - the two outer prongs guide it between ribs, the center prong has a drop of paint on it. Run it down the panel for the desired length of streak.

Something to free me up from running streaks solely along the ribs.

If it works out, maybe make a few, having different lateral offsets for the center prong.

Got a few USRA 55-ton rib-side hoppers in the current batch, and will have some 70-ton rib sides in the next; it’ll give me some variety in rust streak placement.

 

[TLOC]

Thank you, TomO!

My next batch is early in the making (initial Dullcote only). I’m think of fashioning a tool to aid in making more varied vertical rust streaks:

A little piece of wood cut to fit in the space between ribs. Cut one end of it to be essentially a three-prong fork - the two outer prongs guide it between ribs, the center prong has a drop of paint on it. Run it down the panel for the desired length of streak.

Something to free me up from running streaks solely along the ribs.

If it works out, maybe make a few, having different lateral offsets for the center prong.

Got a few USRA 55-ton rib-side hoppers in the current batch, and will have some 70-ton rib sides in the next; it’ll give me some variety in rust streak placement.

The rust streaks you did free hand look great. I wouldn’t stifle your creativity by creating a tool as you MIGHT keep getting the same look. But you know best what your are looking for and if a tool helps, go for it.

I have at times used various widths of a Grainer brush

Just keep sharing please.

The audience likes the names of the paint colors and if possible the product number. Another thing we like is the sequence of things. Example: #1 was cleaning the model with… # 2 the fading was done with an airbrushing using…

Pictures, we love pictures but damn they are hard to get… don’t interrupt your creative flow, take pictures when you can

but most of all have fun and share the results

 

[C&OMtnMan]

The rust streaks you did free hand look great. I wouldn’t stifle your creativity by creating a tool as you MIGHT keep getting the same look. But you know best what your are looking for and if a tool helps, go for it.

I have at times used various widths of a Grainer brush
View attachment 174534


Just keep sharing please.

The audience likes the names of the paint colors and if possible the product number. Another thing we like is the sequence of things. Example: #1 was cleaning the model with… # 2 the fading was done with an airbrushing using…

Pictures, we love pictures but damn they are hard to get… don’t interrupt your creative flow, take pictures when you can

but most of all have fun and share the results

Thanks for the input, TomO!

I want to get back to a couple of “nuts & bolts” questions for weathering:

An acrylics airbrush thinner: if it’s other than water, what is it?

I find my acrylics thinned via the thinner, to take a while to dry. Ive read that acrylics dry quickly, but it seems something like Testors Dullcote dries considerably faster. Would thinning (acrylics, not the Dullcote) with water allow for faster drying?

Your fade mix that uses 4 drops white, 16 drops isopropy, and two drops Tamiya X-21…that’s gotta be fairly fast-drying, I imagine?

Also, do you do any work in color thinning like that with IPA (sans the X-21, of course), like your rust layer washes you’ve done on the tankers?

I know you mention the 99% Isopropyl being harder to find locally, but it is readily available via Amazon. Doesn’t arrive too quick, though, because it’s too flammable for air transport.

 

[TLOC]

I thin Tamiya Arcylics with the Isopropyl Alcohol. I also have used but very rarely the X-20A thinner by Tamiya.

Vallejo paints, the Air, Panzer Aces and Model Color I now only use tap water. I was thinning with the Vallejo brand and it would clog my airbrushes like nothing. Very hard to clean. Now just using water to thin Vallejo.

I am back to occasionally spraying Vallejo thinned with water.

Starting out I would use the paint manufacturers thinner

Still experimenting but have found using very hot water in the airbrush after being done spraying Vallejo Air cleans the airbrush easily. Hot water from the coffee maker into a thermos bottle. Pipette used to add the hot water to the AB Paint cup.

Drying times really vary and I’m not trying to dodge the question. The environment that the spraying is being done in may cause variations in drying times. I really don’t pay that much attention anymore but I pretty much can do some more work on a model after 15 to 20 minutes. A lot of my weathering is washes and done wet on wet. That means I don’t wait for the paint to dry. Rust streaking I do let dry more often then I would adding grime layers to the cars.

Fading, interesting question. First off I use a turn table in the spray both. Also at the bench! I start on the end with the brake wheel, spray and turn. Then the side, spray and turn. I continue until the whole car is sprayed. I will move the unit aside and work on 1 or 2 more units that will use the same fade mix. After the third unit is sprayed the first unit is usually ready to spray again. Based on that I would say there is 15 to 20 minutes of drying time for the first car. When I am satisfied with the fading applications I will put the cars into a dehydrator for 90 minutes minimum but more often overnight. While the acrylics are dry the overnight hardens them up!

If I am thinning paint and it’s Tamiya I am thinning with IPA.

If it’s one of the Vallejo or now Mission paints I am thinning with water

99% IPA is tough to get at reasonable prices in So. Central WIsconsin. I paid $2.99 for 70% for 16 oz. this morning at my local pharmacy within our grocery store. Before Covid that was under $1.00. The pharmacist today told me she will order 2 gallons of 99% and they will be here next week, $15.00 each but no more after that. I having been asking for her to order for months whenever I pick up my meds. I can live with that. The $30 to $40 each plus shipping on Amazon is too much

I know it’s been said in this thread before. Try something and write down the formula, the time, whatever. You will find what works for you. Once the unit has been sprayed and you wait 10, 20 or however many minutes it takes as long as it looks good (no unintentional spotting), all is good.

Some suggested you tubing

Barbados Rex, reviews just about every paint, thinner, cleaners on a spray booth work bench

danrailroad2012, excellent weathering and explains very well but really can talk

Boomer Diorama, I am a huge disciple of Boomer. Doesn’t have many weathering videos but his overall work, his video productions are outstanding. He is a huge Tamiya and Vallejo user. Teaches very well

JC rip track, seems inactive lately but start at the beginning of his videos. Excellent weatherer and instructs very well and does not talk over or around you.

Hope this helps

 

[C&OMtnMan]

Here, TomO

99% Isopropyl from Amazon, 12 16-oz bottles, interestingly, sez two-day Amazon Prime. That’s $2.50 per bottle:

I’ve watched a number of Boomer’s videos. Learned initially about 99% Isopropyl and Tamiya X-21 from him. Can’t say that his technique of putting some isopropyl in the X-21 bottle and putting the mixture on the model and brushing it off when dry, works for me. I tinker with some of his other techniques, and respect what he can do.

I’ve been considering wet-on-wet technique, to get smoother blending/transitions.

 

[TLOC]

Here, TomO

99% Isopropyl from Amazon, 12 16-oz bottles, interestingly, sez two-day Amazon Prime. That’s $2.50 per bottle:

View attachment 174544

I’ve watched a number of Boomer’s videos. Learned initially about 99% Isopropyl and Tamiya X-21 from him. Can’t say that his technique of putting some isopropyl in the X-21 bottle and putting the mixture on the model and brushing it off when dry, works for me. I tinker with some of his other techniques, and respect what he can do.

I’ve been considering wet-on-wet technique, to get smoother blending/transitions.

I have tried the Tamiya x-21 direct from the bottle undiluted and thinned 50/50 with IPA. IMO the fading it does is great. The brushing off the chalky finish is a PITA and often caused damage to parts of the cars. Not worth the time and efforts

 

[Snowman]

Thank you, TomO!

My next batch is early in the making (initial Dullcote only). I’m think of fashioning a tool to aid in making more varied vertical rust streaks:

A little piece of wood cut to fit in the space between ribs. Cut one end of it to be essentially a three-prong fork - the two outer prongs guide it between ribs, the center prong has a drop of paint on it. Run it down the panel for the desired length of streak.

Something to free me up from running streaks solely along the ribs.

If it works out, maybe make a few, having different lateral offsets for the center prong.

Got a few USRA 55-ton rib-side hoppers in the current batch, and will have some 70-ton rib sides in the next; it’ll give me some variety in rust streak placement.

This idea of yours is also one of mine: "I’m think of fashioning a tool to aid in making more varied vertical rust streaks." It's just one of the projects I'd like to try if I buy a laser cutter/engraver.

As an alternative, you can use superfine tip brushes and what are much more inks than they are paints. Or which are super-thinned paints anyway.

But you might also try a tool made for an entirely different purpose. This is essentially what I contemplate making with a micro laser...but you can buy it now. Today.

https://www.amazon.com/Precision-Wo...ocphy=9052568&hvtargid=pla-1210597636966&th=1

These are intended for fine placement and measurements of small graphic lead pencil lines. But you'll notice some of them have not just open circles for the leads, but also grooves. You MIGHT be able to drip thinned paints or inks through those--or even through the circle openings themselves--onto the model. I myself would probably add some tape between the tool and the surface of the car, in order to eliminate capillary attraction as much as possible. You might also shift the tool a bit and add another layer. And yet another layer. Drip thinned liquids through, and then clean them IMMEDIATELY so the grooves and holes don't close up. Some of model media can dry/cure almost instantly...so beware, lest you have to clean them out manually.

It's not at all necessary to paint or drip paint or ink through every groove or dot either, thus you can avoid the appearance of a pattern.

---------

N scale requires twice the precision, IMO, in application of vertical weathering than does HO. So N-scalers need finer tools and thinner weathering colors. Size 00000000 brushes (ie: just one single fine hamster hair tip, etc.) vs. the 000 for other scales.

One other idea, and this comes from seeing some recent applications of rust spots (by others here, not me) using open-hole type masks. Try different sizes of micro-dust-dirt filtering screens...and clean them with almost every single shot from an airbrush, if you contemplate using that tool. I'd almost say clean the mesh before you even look at the results.

One easy, cheap, and widely available type of such screens can be found in simple kitchen tools like: https://www.amazon.com/Hvanam-Strainer-Stainless-Cooking-Colander/dp/B09QYBCJ14/ref=sr_1_6?crid=G0N76F5WTVX1&keywords=kitchen+filter+sifters&qid=1695716479&sprefix=kitchen+filter+sifters,aps,101&sr=8-6&th=1

Mesh screens themselves are available in many sizes, and you can make your own variations by painting (closing) any number of the openings, but leaving others open. There are also fabric or plastic meshes available from a lot of sources. And then you can get even more variation, if using an airbrush, by changing the distance between the brush, the screen or filter, and the side of the car.

If you figure out some good methods, do feel free to post back. Oh please do.

 

[C&OMtnMan]

I have tried the Tamiya x-21 direct from the bottle undiluted and thinned 50/50 with IPA. IMO the fading it does is great. The brushing off the chalky finish is a PITA and often caused damage to parts of the cars. Not worth the time and efforts

In addition to it being hard to get off, I never really saw a fading effect; I saw fine abrasions on the surface that made colors look faded only at certain viewing angles. And the residue that hung out at rhe joints between panels & ribs, or on box roofs was awful

What is your reason for including it in your fade formulation? A surface texture effect? Contributing to the fade? Or does the titanium sand bite into the painted surface and keep paint in place?

 

[TLOC]

In addition to it being hard to get off, I never really saw a fading effect; I saw fine abrasions on the surface that made colors look faded only at certain viewing angles. And the residue that hung out at rhe joints between panels & ribs, or on box roofs was awful

What is your reason for including it in your fade formulation? A surface texture effect? Contributing to the fade? Or does the titanium sand bite into the painted surface and keep paint in place?

IMO the Tamiya x-21 base makes the fade even more matte/dull.

Sometimes if there was residue remaining I would take after drying a fine point brush with Vallejo Air burnt umber and touch those spots, made for some great textured rust. As the volume of my commissions have increased using X-21 base alone or thinned with IPA just didn’t make sense any longer. The brush off time as I wrote previously was too long and often some would get damaged. The

last model I used a thin mixture of x-21 was my own GP40-2L. The model definitely faded!

 

[C&OMtnMan]

IMO the Tamiya x-21 base makes the fade even more matte/dull.

The last model I used a thin mixture of x-21 was my own GP40-2L. The model definitely faded!

Do you run the fade mix with X-21 through your airbrush, given that the X-21 contains fine-grained sand?

Oh, I can tell that it fades well “in the right hands,” as I have read this thread from Post #1, and saw what you achieved on the gondolas in the early posts!

I just began weathering this past February, got two bottles of the X-21 back then, trying to figure out now how to advantageously use it.

 

[C&OMtnMan]

Snowman,

Interesting suggestions all, but I’m thinking more of something I make myself, from wood.

In my 20’s, I got into building wooden model ships, and have many small-scale woodworking tool, and many small scraps still (when you’re working with exotics like boxwood, holly, pearwood, cocobolo, etc, you hang on to the bits. Yes, even for 35+ years!)

And, I still have my 4” Jarmac hobby table saw, with its little 220-tooth blade, and new lighting installed in my garage.

I envision cutting some slots lengthwise along some short strips of wood I have, running paint along the ridges left between the slots, then pivoting them down onto the panels of the hopper.

I’ve got hundreds of scraps already planed down to 0.160”, 0.167”, and 0.174” thickness. Those will fit between my hopper ribs, and leave a little room for varying lateral placement of the rust streaks.

 

[TLOC]

Do you run the fade mix with X-21 through your airbrush, given that the X-21 contains fine-grained sand?

Oh, I can tell that it fades well “in the right hands,” as I have read this thread from Post #1, and saw what you achieved on the gondolas in the early posts!

I just began weathering this past February, got two bottles of the X-21 back then, trying to figure out now how to advantageously use it.

Yes, when added to the fade color mixture it’s for the airbrush. Shake very well!

Best IMO use of x-21 now is adding it to the fade coloring mixture. 2nd would be a 50/50mixture and hand brushing it on SOME areas of a model.

 

[TLOC]

Snowman,

Interesting suggestions all, but I’m thinking more of something I make myself, from wood.

In my 20’s, I got into building wooden model ships, and have many small-scale woodworking tool, and many small scraps still (when you’re working with exotics like boxwood, holly, pearwood, cocobolo, etc, you hang on to the bits. Yes, even for 35+ years!)

And, I still have my 4” Jarmac hobby table saw, with its little 220-tooth blade, and new lighting installed in my garage.

I envision cutting some slots lengthwise along some short strips of wood I have, running paint along the ridges left between the slots, then pivoting them down onto the panels of the hopper.

I’ve got hundreds of scraps already planed down to 0.160”, 0.167”, and 0.174” thickness. Those will fit between my hopper ribs, and leave a little room for varying lateral placement of the rust streaks.

Cannot wait to see the results

 

[C&OMtnMan]

Cannot wait to see the results

“THIS is a job for the Atlas 90-ton test car!”

 

[Snowman]

Snowman,

Interesting suggestions all, but I’m thinking more of something I make myself, from wood.

In my 20’s, I got into building wooden model ships, and have many small-scale woodworking tool, and many small scraps still (when you’re working with exotics like boxwood, holly, pearwood, cocobolo, etc, you hang on to the bits. Yes, even for 35+ years!)

And, I still have my 4” Jarmac hobby table saw, with its little 220-tooth blade, and new lighting installed in my garage.

I envision cutting some slots lengthwise along some short strips of wood I have, running paint along the ridges left between the slots, then pivoting them down onto the panels of the hopper.

I’ve got hundreds of scraps already planed down to 0.160”, 0.167”, and 0.174” thickness. Those will fit between my hopper ribs, and leave a little room for varying lateral placement of the rust streaks.

Makes sense, particularly if you want to make a custom tool to fit directly over a particular spacing between ribs.

Curious for sure to see how both the tool(s) and the results turn out.

 

[C&OMtnMan]

Ok, I’ve got some progress to report on my current batch of hoppers. A little bit different mix of hardware this time:

4 Bachmann Silver Series USRA 55-ton rib-side hoppers (3 Chesapeake & Ohio, 1 Clinchfield)

2 Atlas offset side 55-ton hoppers ( all C&O)

1 Atlas 90-ton rib side 3-bay hopper (not the same one from last time; I wanted to test out less weathering than before with different techniques.

Below are two of the hoppers in their natural state:

A base clear flat of Bottle Dullcote thinned 1:1 with laquer thinner was applied via airbrush, again outdoors & upside down:

Then, a fade coat using @TLOC ‘s recipe of 80% isopropyl (99% strength), 20% Tamiya white and a few drops of Tamiya X-21 flate base. A succession of light medium, and heavy fades below:

This method worked vey well for me. I did use 50% more X-21 than TomO’s recipe, as my current bottle of X-21 had previously been thinned by 1/3, with IPA. For every three drops of X-21 I put in, I subtracted 1 drop of IPA from the recipe to account for the alcohol in my X-21.

My first batch of it was small and ran out. I thinned the second batch with more alcohol to achieve a 6:1 ratio, for finer control of the amount of fade. I think I can also do more with dialing back on the paint flow.

Then three of the cars received an airbrushed rust wash, Vallejo Air burnt umber, thinned further with water. Back inside and right side up:

That’s where these are at right now. On deck:

Individual rust spots on cars, then chalk for localized grime/dust fade, and final sealing with Valejjo matte varnish. To be followed by weathering wheels & trucks, then reattaching them to the bodies.

 

[C&OMtnMan]

The forum software limits you to ten photos per post. Here is the last:

My two test cars, the one that is part of the current batch is in front, mission accomplished regarding less fade and lesser rust wash layer.

The first one (in back) has lost the pinkish hue it had when first completed, so it’s rather grown on me since then.

 

[migalyto]

Awesome job!!

I think they look very well done.

 

[TLOC]

The forum software limits you to ten photos per post. Here is the last:

View attachment 174964

My two test cars, the one that is part of the current batch is in front, mission accomplished regarding less fade and lesser rust wash layer.

The first one (in back) has lost the pinkish hue it had when first completed, so it’s rather grown on me since then.

I think they look super. Glad to read you playing around with the formulas.

 

[TLOC]

Back from a shorten travel adventure.

Client supplied a few Aurora Miniature boxcars for weathering and also supplied the graffiti decals that he wanted used. The cars per prototype info were built in 9/2018 and he supplied pictures of the actual car numbers taken in 9/2022. 4 years later these are still relatively clean cars.

So together we decided to try a couple different approaches.

Here are the 2 cars

The COER car has been faded and I realized I did not have the before and after shot. This picture of the AOK car is right after opening the box, nothing done to it. This shows the difference after fading

The COER has been faded with a desert earth mix of various Tamiya colors sprayed twice and left to dry. There has been no clear matte finish applied, yet! The underside has been sprayed with the Tamiya Hull Red with maybe 10% Tamiya Black added. So a 10% Black, 40% Hull Red and 50% Isopropyl Alcohol

The AOK car only has had a clear matte finished applied. I used the Army Painter matte clear Air sprayed once and allowed to dry then did another spray

I am waiting for an ok