PECO Switch Motor Wiring help?


KB02

KB02

Well-Known Member
Just installed a new Peco turnout with the matching Peco Turnout motor on my layout. I followed the instructions on wiring up the motor, but I am not getting proper action of the turnout. All I get is buzzing. When the rails are set to follow the main line, the motor will buzz (loudly) every time I try to throw the switch (SPDT Momentary switch) in either direction. When the rails are set to follow the diverging track, I only get buzzing in one direction and not the other. The motor is not stuck and the turnout switches rails by hand without any problem. Before I start just experimenting and burn something out, is there something obvious that I should try? The only part of the instructions that I did not follow was adding in a "CDU" (whatever that is)

Any thoughts?
 
KB02 said:
Just installed a new Peco turnout with the matching Peco Turnout motor on my layout. I followed the instructions on wiring up the motor, but I am not getting proper action of the turnout. All I get is buzzing. When the rails are set to follow the main line, the motor will buzz (loudly) every time I try to throw the switch (SPDT Momentary switch) in either direction. When the rails are set to follow the diverging track, I only get buzzing in one direction and not the other. The motor is not stuck and the turnout switches rails by hand without any problem. Before I start just experimenting and burn something out, is there something obvious that I should try? The only part of the instructions that I did not follow was adding in a "CDU" (whatever that is)

Any thoughts?
Click to expand...

CDU is Caspasitor Discharge Unit. Not sure but that could be your problem. You may need some research on that.
 
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KB02 said:
Just installed a new Peco turnout with the matching Peco Turnout motor on my layout. I followed the instructions on wiring up the motor, but I am not getting proper action of the turnout. All I get is buzzing. When the rails are set to follow the main line, the motor will buzz (loudly) every time I try to throw the switch (SPDT Momentary switch) in either direction. When the rails are set to follow the diverging track, I only get buzzing in one direction and not the other. The motor is not stuck and the turnout switches rails by hand without any problem. Before I start just experimenting and burn something out, is there something obvious that I should try? The only part of the instructions that I did not follow was adding in a "CDU" (whatever that is)
Click to expand...
CDU - Capacitance Discharge Unit. All that would do is add more kick power. Irrelevant to your problem.

Did you test the turnout motor before it was installed?
You are caning you can see the motor move when you manually change the turnout?
A possibility is that the common wire and one of the direction wires has been crossed at the turnout, such that the power is going through both coils instead of just one. The turnout "motor" in this case is simply a set of electromagnetic coils. If power is going through both coils the plunger will not move. What I cannot explain with this idea is why it would behave differently when the turnout is in one position vs the other.
 
With the volume of the buzzing I get, I doubt it is a matter of getting more "Kick" to switch the motor. The instructions seemed to imply, and subsequent Google searching seems to indicate that this is a optional addition.

I will double check the wiring tonight. I did not test it prior to installation, I figured it would just work. I will report back on my findings.
 
It sounds like you have the neutral wire on the wrong pin. If your power supply is pretty weak or running at capacity it could also cause your issue.

If you are trying to throw multiple switches with one button, you will need a capacitor to store enough energy to throw all the switches at one time. We are using Pecos at our club and in the yard I run, we have a couple of positions that will pull in excess of 7 amps to throw them all. To do that you will need to set up a diode matrix to keep from backfeeding the other turnouts. I know you didn't ask about the CPU, but I thought I would let you know when you need them.

Good Luck,
Joe
 
Here is what I found out from my tinkering last night.

I pulled the motor off the turnout and tried it without touching the wiring. The motor worked as it should. So this leads me to believe that the motor is good and the wiring is correct. Right?

Upon re-installation of the motor on the turnout, the same situation occurred. Perhaps the power to the motor is not strong enough?

The instructions say that 16v AC is recommended and that a CDU can be used but is not necessary. You'll have to forgive my weakness in electrical theory, but I think I SHOULD have enough power in my Cab unit to push it. This is what the Cab says it has for power:
OUTPUT: 17 VDC. 20 VAC
MAX OUTPUT: 7 VA Total

All of my other turnouts, which, admittedly, are mostly Atlas Snap-Switches, are wired to work off of this Cab and work fine. I only have one turnout wired per switch, though they do run off of a common buss.

Still confused...

If I do need a CDU, do I have to buy one from Peco, or can I make one cheap and easy from the parts bins at Radio Shack?
 
KB02 said:
I pulled the motor off the turnout and tried it without touching the wiring. The motor worked as it should. So this leads me to believe that the motor is good and the wiring is correct. Right?
Click to expand...
I would say so.

Upon re-installation of the motor on the turnout, the same situation occurred. Perhaps the power to the motor is not strong enough?
Click to expand...
Do the instructions say anything about removing the spring? For the life of me I cannot recall if the ones I have mounted have the spring or not. Unfortunately they are 500 miles away so I can't just go look at them.

If I do need a CDU, do I have to buy one from Peco, or can I make one cheap and easy from the parts bins at Radio Shack?
Click to expand...
All a CDU does is store some extra current in a capacitor such that when the load is applied it dumps that extra current through the system. Yes, they can be made from scratch quite easily, but having said that I have to admit I have never built one for turnouts. Mine were all for getting slot cars to zoom off the line.
 
I don't use the PECO switches or know much about your power supply but I did some research and IMO you may not have enough power to throw the track points. If the switch works without any issue when removed then either the track is binding or causing the switch to not work correctly or again may be not enough to power. I just did a Google search on the PECO switch and related problems and found lots of issues similar to yours where a CDU was useful. Is your power supply the one recommended for that switch? Make sure nothing else is attached to the power supply. I don't remember you saying but do the track points move freely when moved with your finger? Might see if PECO has any type tech support.
 
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It sounds to me like you definitely need more current going through the coils, meaning you may need the CDU. Another approach would be to buy a separate AC power supply and wire that PECO motor separately from your cab unit. I bought one meant as a booster for DCC, though it has nothing to do with running DCC. All my switch machines, whether Atlas or whatever are run off that, rather than the AC accessory outputs on the cab unit.

As far as removing the spring from the turnout throwbar is concerned, the PECO switch machines are intended to work with the spring IN. That is because the motors themselves don't have a positive position lock as do most others. I personally don't care much for the PECO machines. I use various twin-coil machines that have positive position locks. Tortise machines are also good, but I don't have room under the surface of my layout in a number of spots due to the benchwork being in the way. I use twin-coil switch machines, which have a lot of throw force. Unfortunately, they are no longer made, or at least I can't find them. Good luck!
 
Before you do anything else, try this. In between the points is a flat plastic plate, and if you look REAL close you can see 2 very fine wires poking up, one in the plate and one in the cross tie. There are 2 metal tabs that lay on top of that plastic plate. Very gently loosen up the tension on both tabs by bending the tabs up just enough to allow you to slide the plate. This plate is the tension adjustment for the over center spring that holds the points against the rails. gently slide the plate away from the crossbar and that will remove some of the tension and should let you throw the turnout easier. Just get it loose enough to make it reliable. You still need a little tension to hold the points against the rails. After getting it working to your satisfaction, press the tabs back down with a small screwdriver.

If you have an auxiliary switch under the motor (to control status lights), very carefully check out the alignment of the motor to the switch. The pin coming up out of the motor has to be perfectly straight up and perpendicular to the switch. If the pin is off just a little, it will bind up the whole switch.

If this doesn't help, let us know and we will walk you through the capacitor installation. If everything is working properly, you should never need a capacitor to throw a single switch though.

Good Luck,
Joe
 
Hi KB02

You said that when you took the switch out that it worked ok, so that takes care of the switch, apparently it is working fine. What I think is happening is that you are trying to switch the points in a direction that they are already in, if the points are to the right and you try to switch them to the right then
you will get the buzzing, check the wiring to the Peko unit, if you are sure it is correct then move the points with your hand to the opposite side of what they
are then try the switch and see what happens.
 
Sorry, been away for about a week.

I get the buzzing no matter which direction I throw the switch.

I haven't had much time to work on it. I'll try to check out Joe's suggestion this week and get back to you all.
 
josephbw said:
Before you do anything else, try this. In between the points is a flat plastic plate, and if you look REAL close you can see 2 very fine wires poking up, one in the plate and one in the cross tie. There are 2 metal tabs that lay on top of that plastic plate. Very gently loosen up the tension on both tabs by bending the tabs up just enough to allow you to slide the plate. This plate is the tension adjustment for the over center spring that holds the points against the rails. gently slide the plate away from the crossbar and that will remove some of the tension and should let you throw the turnout easier. Just get it loose enough to make it reliable. You still need a little tension to hold the points against the rails. After getting it working to your satisfaction, press the tabs back down with a small screwdriver.
Click to expand...

Well, the problem seems to be solved and Joe and Suzie seemed to have had the answer that worked for me. HOWEVER, I really don't know if I should thank you two or curse you for making me go in and fight with that little, tiny, hard to see and nearly IMPOSSIBLE TO FIND ON THE FLOOR spring! (guess why I call it that...) :rolleyes: I could not seem to find any way to adjust the position of that plate so I ended up putting a second hole in the plate so the spring would be under less pressure. After fighting to get it all back together, for the better part of an hour, I now have just enough tension to hold it in positive lock on each side (but just barely) and the motor works fine.

Thanks, everyone, for their help and tips! Very much appreciated!
 
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