peco single slip power

[WilliamQ]

Hello all, my son convinced me to pull the boxes of trains out of the attic and we are setting up an N-scale hollow door layout. I have a Peco single slip from 22 years ago that I would like to use to create two separate loops. I understand that Peco Electrofrog turnouts require power from the "foot", but I'm scratching my head trying to figure out what that means since the points point in both directions.
We're not planning on DCC but it would be nice to isolate the single slip so we can run two trains on two loops some time in the future.
Thanks!
William

 

[Selector]

You can't/shouldn't isolate it unless it comprises part of one or more 'reverse loops' where the two rails come back onto each other through a loop from one turnout. If your rails never confound each other anywhere and can cause a short where they meet due to polarity conflict, then simply use metal joiners wherever there are rails, and let the joiners power the turnout throughout. For reliability and less drag on the fun factor, after you have proven this and find that you can run trains through the slip successfully, both directions, you should solder one pair of joiners at least because joiners weaken and get crud in them, which presses them away from metal contact.

If what you envision is going to be a loop, and reverse the polarity, then you do need to isolate the loop that causes conflict, not the turnout. simply leave gaps where the loop starts and ends, and power the loop via a DPDT (double pole, double throw) toggle switch. You'll have to flip the toggle every time a train enters the loop from which ever direction so that when the metal tires bridge the gaps, there won't be an immediate short.

 

[Iron Horseman]

I have a Peco single slip from 22 years ago that I would like to use to create two separate loops.

Do you mean two loops that cross each other, or a folded figure 8 where one loop is inside the other?

I understand that Peco Electrofrog turnouts require power from the "foot", but I'm scratching my head trying to figure out what that means since the points point in both directions.

As soon as you put a turnout in a loop the power is coming both ways anyway so that rule of thumb is out the window.

A Peco electrofrog in a loop will require an insulated joiner or gap on the frog rail that is in the loop. With two frogs that will mean two gaps, and with two loops that could mean 4 gaps. and an additional feeder. Would have to see a track diagram to know for certain.

 

[WilliamQ]

Sorry, I should have been more clear. There are no reversing loops in our track plan (which is from Mike @ http://www.cke1st.com). I'm attaching a diagram. It's a folded-over dogbone, more or less. I realized that you replace the left crossover with a single-slip, you can have two independent tracks and potentially have two trains running at the same time, which would make it more interesting, especially since the trains will have to negotiate the remaining crossing.
Since then I have plugged in the single-slip and, without relays (which may or may not be incorporated into the Peco motors; I don't know), the slip must be powered from all 4 directions. That's fine with me, since it means I can just add a DPDT toggle switch to control the "inner loop" either from controller A (meaning the whole layout is controlled from A), or switch the inner loop to controller B. I'm not running short locomotives so I'm not concerned about powering the frog.

 

[Iron Horseman]

I realized that you replace the left crossover with a single-slip, you can have two independent tracks and potentially have two trains running at the same time, which would make it more interesting, especially since the trains will have to negotiate the remaining crossing.

Cool, I like the plan. Totally different than what I was thinking

Since then I have plugged in the single-slip and, without relays (which may or may not be incorporated into the Peco motors; I don't know), the slip must be powered from all 4 directions. That's fine with me, since it means I can just add a DPDT toggle switch to control the "inner loop" either from controller A (meaning the whole layout is controlled from A), or switch the inner loop to controller B. I'm not running short locomotives so I'm not concerned about powering the frog.

That is not an electrofrog turnout, so you can put it anywhere without concern of gaps or insulated joiners (other than what you want for having multiple power supplies).

You can tell it is Insulfrog by the two plastic gaps in the closure rails (circled in yellow), and also the thin piece of insulation between the two frog rails (underlined in green). An electrofrog would have solid rail in both those locations.

 

[WilliamQ]

I'm not sure if the plastic frog insulators mean it's not electrofrog, in the case of a slip, because the frog polarity needs to change based on the action of both throws, not just one. The package says it's a Peco SL-380F, "N Universal Fine Electrofrog". I think they insulate the frogs because, if you want them powered, they are wired to the outside leads and you are supposed to energize the frog from the opposing points, which means using a relay (which Peco also sells as an accessory controller under the motor).
For now I'm probably going to leave it unwired.

 

[Iron Horseman]

I'm not sure if the plastic frog insulators mean it's not electrofrog, in the case of a slip, because the frog polarity needs to change based on the action of both throws, not just one.

Yes, thinking about it now it makes sense as this is a double turnout, with double power routing issues and advantages.