N scale Plan - request for comments


nephthyr

nephthyr

Member
Hi,

Small switching layout, 1 x 7 foot N scale. No evil switchbacks - yay!

The plastics manufacturer uses "sure spots" to make switching more engaging. I also wanted a small yard to do some minor classification.

Since I have a thing for grain elevators and covered grain hoppers that was a given as was the oil dealer - I need an excuse for those beautiful Atlas tank cars. Also an engine facility was also a must. I think I managed to cram that all in quite nicely.

Ops session starts with the loco picking up cars left on the interchange and moving them into the yard. Added to some cars transferred from the main yard, the loco then sorts these into those going to local industries and those that are outbound (off the layout). The local industries are then spotted - some cars remain in position (respotted). Finally some more classification is done, and the cars destined for the interchange are spotted on those tracks. Cars for the main yard (the rest of the railroad) can then be sorted into east bounds and west bounds. That's the theory anyway. :D

Granted it is very linear but I like that kind of design anyways, some might not. I think I'm going to switch to N scale. Just so much more you can do in a limited space.

Let me know what you all think.

View attachment 22728
 
Might need room at the left

I think you'll be happy to leave out the switchbacks.

The new plan reminds me a bit of my Alameda Belt Line N scale switching layout in 1X6 from Model Railroad Planning 2005.

A couple of folks have built variations of the ABL layout and enjoyed it, so the basic concept is "field proven".

You might want to open some space between the tracks on the left, if you are going to have a shed over the grain elevator loading/unloading area.

In real life, grain elevator tracks can typically only be half full, as the cars need to be rolled for loading or unloading, but folks do compromise on this on smaller layouts sometimes and just spot the track full as you've shown.

Best of luck with your project.

Byron
 
Love the Layout!

I am in the process of building a 4x8 HO scale layout of Chicago's Union Station specifically for the purpose of sorting ad switching passenger cars into different consists for different routes. I will not even include a loop, just a Wye to turn trains/locos as needed. Great track plan for a small space.
 
Hi Byron,

Thanks for the reply. I actually drew inspiration from your Alameda Belt Line plan and a few other designs you have on your web site. I am aware of the grain elevator problem, I plan to do full size mock ups and refine the track plan then.

I also plan to run the layout half-full so there's a better "ebb and flow", too many cars will yield a dreaded switching puzzle syndrome that I so desperately want to avoid on this layout.

I think what I like most about this plan is that none of the buildings are backdrop flats, an illusion which in my opinion only works if the layout is viewed at eye level head on, from above or the side - low relief buildings tend to ruin the illusion. The other thing I like is that the layout offers some great scenicking potential. One thing I did purposefully on this layout was to place the larger / taller structures to the rear and have smaller structures toward the front which means that reaching cars on further tracks isn't limited in any way.

It still has a little more track than I wanted but given the things that I wanted to include its a fair trade off.
 
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One difference from Byron's Alameda Belt Lines (which I also thought about when I saw your layout plan), is that Byron has a dedicated switch lead on the left side of his layout.

On your layout, you will have to empty out e.g. the interchange track and keep it (at least mostly) empty to have room for a switching lead when switching the yard or the plastic industry.

I'd suggest splitting the bottommost track on the left and keeping the second track from the top on the left as a switching lead for the yard.

Maybe also try to screen both front corners with structures, and keep the front center fairly open, so it is more like a stage - the railroad "continues" both to the right and the left, disappearing behind buildings.

You could e.g put a small single stall engine house in the lower right and the bulk oil dealer at lower left, leaving the center front track for the team track.

Orienting things so not all the tracks are totally parallel to each other and to the layout front might also be a good idea - maybe put the whole thing at a gentle slant, and let a couple of the front tracks curve gently?

Sketch illustrating what I mean:

abl01.jpg


Just a couple of suggestions - feel free to grab anything that appeals to you and leave anything that doesn't appeal to you.

Grin,
Stein
 
Wow! I like what you have done. Curving those tracks and including a switch lead were really good ideas. I think I'm going to use your track plan, if you dont mind. Very neat!
 
Nice! I like I like......Say,what measurements will the layout be?....or did I miss something?!......So,fellow South African railroader....what's gonna happen to your HO scale stuff then?........Funny how both of us seem to have layout space problems......I finally got the space I needed for a nice layout...even through it's only 1x6meters......Can't wait to see your layout progress pics etc......Good Luck ;)
 
Jannie said:
Nice! I like I like......Say,what measurements will the layout be?....or did I miss something?
Click to expand...

According to the first post in the thread, 1 x 7 feet - i.e. about 30 x 210 centimeters - about 1/3rd of the space you have for your layout.

Grin,
Stein, pretty much due north of the RSA, at about 10E, 60N :)
 
I missed that 1.sorry....

I've had to build my layout basically into & around my PC desk & TV cabinet,I really have no more space left & I don't think I can get more into it......on my left wing I have to 'cut down' on my scenery at the far end,otherwise I won't be able to watch TV ;) ....LOL!....in the middle both tracks run behing my PC on top of my desk.......but,wow! 30cm x 210.....that's small....N scale sure would make it easier to get alot into that space....keep us updated
 
It's actually 305mm x 2135mm since the conversion is 305mm to the foot. Its very interesting, despite the metric system we have here in SA, timber is still pretty much in measurements indicating foot and inches. You can buy a conventional 4 x 8 sheet of plywood at almost any hardware store and it actually measures 1220mm x 2440mm.

What is surprising is that I bought a piece of laminated pine that's designed to be used as a shelf and it's 7' in length, not 8'. Not sure why, but its actually a blessing in disguise, I can buy conventional 8' lumber to frame it and the extra foot will be used on the ends, so I'll only need two 8' pieces of 1x3 instead of more.

Although I would have liked to sell my HO stuff to fund the new N scale stuff, It would absolutely break my heart to sell it, I have so much sentimental attachment to it its not even funny. The other considertion is that at present I do not have the space, but who knows what the future may hold, perhaps one day. My mistake was that I too hastily rushed into HO scale without seriously considering N scale (at the time) and also back then I was living in a much bigger house with a lot more space.

N scale is growing on me, I have a few pieces of track and a few items of rolling stock, and I'm now getting used to the scale. Looking at HO stuff, it now seem gigantic in comparison.

Although I often considered changing era or prototype, for some reason I always come back to those blue and yellow diesels, there's just something about the Santa Fe that draws me, like a moth to a flame.
 
That's good to hear....I almost sold all my stuff years ago,seeing that we moved from a huge house to a kind of a cottage & I couldn't build anything anyways.......before my current layout,the last time I had a decent layout was about 12yrs ago....but luckily I kept all my stuff all those years......Funny thing,my local hobby shop here in Paarl ( Benchmark Models ) stock alot of N scale stuff & have a wide variety of locos these days.....please keep us updated on your progess...I like seeing other folks' layouts take shape...J
 
nephthyr said:
It's actually 305mm x 2135mm since the conversion is 305mm to the foot. Its very interesting, despite the metric system we have here in SA, timber is still pretty much in measurements indicating foot and inches. You can buy a conventional 4 x 8 sheet of plywood at almost any hardware store and it actually measures 1220mm x 2440mm.
Click to expand...

Same thing in Norway.

Norway has been metric since 1875.

We still sell lumber and sheets of insulation in 4x8 foot format. Except we call a 4x8 (foot) sheet a 120 x 240 (centimeter) sheet. Not totally accurate - it is actually 122 x 244 centimeters.

We still talk about beams as being 2x4 or 2x6, though, we call a yard stick a "tommestokk" ("an inch stick"), and they generally are marked both in centimeters and inches.

But at least we only have one kind of inches these days. I also have an old yard stick that the Royal Norwegian Navy in exile in Britain during WW2 used - it has three sets of measurements - centimeters, "Danish inches" and "London (ie English) inches".

Anyways - I guess that was a total digression.

Grin,
Stein
 
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Nice.I was just thinking of something......I see you've got an 'Avenue'....in other words,a bridge ending off the 1 side of your layout.....I once saw a shelf layout with similar track layout,but the guy had a kinda 'ferris wheel' with 4 tracks on it (kinda like the baskets you'll be sitting in in a real ferris wheel)...so he could turn the wheel (which had a full train or rolling stock on it) & let different trains roll out of the same entry/exit & topped it off with a bridge...& a backdrop...hiding the 'wheel'...
 
That ^ is awesome, and a great idea. Rotating staging? Genius.

The plan looks like fun, if you're into switching puzzles. A little staging would add a lot, but it'll work without too. (Also, no reason you couldn't add it in later.) What are your plans for the empty spot in the middle front?
 
RW&C said:
That ^ is awesome, and a great idea. Rotating staging? Genius.

The plan looks like fun, if you're into switching puzzles. A little staging would add a lot, but it'll work without too. (Also, no reason you couldn't add it in later.) What are your plans for the empty spot in the middle front?
Click to expand...

1) Staging is often a good idea. Whether the OP has room for staging or not depends on how much space he has, and what his desired operating pattern is.

I am not so sure that "rotating" ferris wheel staging is such a smart idea. It adds complexity, without adding any appreciable functionality over these three types of simpler mechanisms:

a) (short) train length removable cassette or sets of cassettes, that can be stowed on a shelf somewhere when not in use, or

b) if you can afford the space for permanently set up staging, traverser staging - in principle an open top drawer with several tracks side by side, where you pull the drawer out or push it in to align a different track in the drawer with the track leading into the layout, or

c) elevator staging, where you have several small shelves on a movable back plate, where you move the shelves up or down to align with the track leading into the layout.

And of course - with a small switching layout, not having staging is also possible - just setting up the inbound train on the layout before your operating session starts - "having just arrived" when the operating session starts, and ending the operating session with the train "just about to depart".

Staging is critical if you want to model trains arriving or departing. Or if you want to generate more traffic. But for a small purely switching layout, staging is not a necessity.

2) The plan you are commenting on is a switching layout, but not a switching puzzle as such.

A switching puzzle is a switching track plan deliberately made to be difficult to switch.

A typical characteristic of switching puzzles is a lack of work space, so you will have to move a car several times to get to another car.

A layout where you can pull a string of cars at the same time and where you have adequate leads and place to temporarily store cars you are going to set out or cars you just have pulled from the industries is not a switching puzzle.

You can read more about switching puzzles (and small switching layouts) on Adrian Wymann's excellent Shunting puzzles and small layouts web page at URL http://www.wymann.info/ShuntingPuzzles/

Smile,
Stein
 
You can always have hidden staging on any type of layout,I'm gonna install hidden staging on mine soon.....anyways,I just think (& I think most will agree) that having the option of hidden staging makes for more variety of stock going around on a layout....so you can 'puzzle' your stock around & have a train departure/arrive in the same scene........my 2c ;)

Ps: I like the drawer staging idea......less space
 
Jannie said:
You can always have hidden staging on any type of layout,
Click to expand...

You can almost always add hidden staging.

Whether it makes sense to use part of a small switching layout for staging depends on what you want to model.

If it is important to you to model a train arriving from elsewhere or departing for elsewhere, then hidden staging is smart.

Another neat trick if you want to model a big industry that takes several cars, without having room for the actual industry, is to model just the track leading to the industry and leaving a set of cars there, "to be picked up by the plant switcher later".

Such an industry lead track could disappear behind something or just go across the front of the layout (with the industry supposedly behind the other buildings or in the aisle).

Or be represented by a track in the yard. You still can sort cars into the right order (according to a diagram showing the tracks at the not modeled industry) before shoving the cars into the track where the industry switcher "later" will pick them up.

Lots of ways of doing things. What approach makes the most sense depends on what you want to model.

Smile,
Stein
 
All good points indeed & my thoughts exactly.........in the near future I'm planning a hidden siding or 2 in the middle (as my track now goes behind my PC & is hidden anyways)....But it's as you say,depends on what you're modelling ;)

Ps: Sorry for kinda Hijacking your thread there for a moment ;) ......some updates please...keep well
 
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