HO Layout to fit in a roughly 8x11' space


G

GNfan

New Member
I am working on designing a layout that will be able to be hoisted to the ceiling in my garage. I need one dimension to be 8' so that the suspension system will be on the outside of the door tracks. I have about 11 feet of depth to work with but a vent takes up about 2 feet on one end with about a 9" drop. This would limit scenery height or mean I couldn't pull it up as close to the ceiling there.

Here are my current ideas:
Great Northern and Burlington Northern Cascades through to Glacier National Park but with a link to the Iron Ore region of Minnesota. Want to roughly model Appleyard freight yard in Wenatchee, WA. Possibly add some docks around the Seattle area with another yard (Interbay) and passenger station. This is where the huge grain silos are that load the ships in Puget Sound.

Industries
Grain
Iron Ore
Passenger Service
Coal to power station

Structures
Roundhouse
Engine House
Power House
Grain Elevator
Iron Mine
Foundry
Passenger Station

Mainline
24” min radius
#6 and #8 switches
2” separation straight
2.25” on curves
3% maximum grade

Yard and Industrial
20” min radius

At least 1 yard with 5-6 tracks
Locomotive service facility with 90’ turntable
Min of one Passing track 6’ long
Tunnel
Bridge
Trestle
River

I have a plan I have been working on that is a modified Atlas trackplan of the folded dogbone. This plan would incorporate most of what I want but I am still deciding on if I should go with a sectional approach instead (2' and 4' wide sections). I plan to live in this house for at least 10 more years but someday hope to have an attic space to devote to trains. I am less concerned with ultra realistic operation than I am with scenery possibilities and continuous running. I really want to be able to run my Walthers Empire Builder cars and need 24" min radius for that.

I had also thought about doing just a large yard for now. I have lots of rolling stock and locomotives already (about 70 cars and 15 locomotives) so a yard would allow me to play with some of that.

I will post my dogbone trackplan tommorow.
 
I think your major issue will be desiging benchwork that's both light enough that it can be easily hoisted but not so flimsy that it gets wracked as part of the hoisting process. If everything isn't perfectly level when it's hoisted, you will end up popping off tracks and scenery will go flying. Solve this problem first with a 1:1 test bed and then get on to railroading.
 
I'm with Jim. You may need to frame it with decent sized dimensional lumber so it has good rigidity, but it might get heavy that way. May be worthwhile looking into an inexpensive electric hoist to do the lifting duties.

Sounds like a cool idea though!

Mark
 
Trackplan

I plan to use 1" foam over a 1/4" high quality plywood and 1x4 pine around the edge with 1x2 cleats that the plywood will be glued and screwed to. I think this will provide the rigidity needed. I may even use 2x4's across the lifting points or perhaps aluminum I beams or something similar.

Here is the layout plan. I know I need to add a passing track or two. The track at the back will be in a tunnel and the inside loop will rise up on that terrain to make a 4" crossing over the other track at the bridge. The yard is just a preliminary test. I will also have to add two access holes.

DogboneUpOver8x12.jpg
 
There are several issues I see in your plan, but two major ones.

1) How do you plan to reach the center of your layout. A normal person can reach only 30" without destroying scenery.

2) Your yard indicates a large capacity of rolling stock. Are you going to re-rail your cars in the yard before every operating session?

Have you thought about an 11 x 8 donut shaped layout run from the center?
 
I plan to have removable sections, this is a very preliminary plan I have been messing with. I am still working on figuring out how to use the Atlas software so I haven't got elevations in correctly and the track will all be flex track. I like the longer mainline I get with this design, if I could get nearly 60 feet in a donut then I would probably go for that. Is there a way to do that with some variation i.e. not all parralell tracks? I still need to look at more books. This was just what I came up working with that one plan.

I really want to be able to break the layout into sections and be able to add modules at a later point like the yard.
 
A thought- if you're going to be raising and lowering this regularly (and even if it stays down most of the time) I'd REALLY suggest you use 1/2" BC grade (especially if you're going to cover it in foam) as the structual stability will be much greater. I think only using 1/4 over such a large span is going to give you problems.
 
SSW said:
A thought- if you're going to be raising and lowering this regularly (and even if it stays down most of the time) I'd REALLY suggest you use 1/2" BC grade (especially if you're going to cover it in foam) as the structual stability will be much greater. I think only using 1/4 over such a large span is going to give you problems.
Click to expand...

I'm with that too - yes it'll be heavier, but it's already going to be heavy and the rigidity will be improved. Maybe even 5/8" ply - an extra layer of ply couldn't hurt.

Mark
 
Here's a copy of the BAD Western plan which is about the size you're looking at (7'-9" x 10'-6"). The reach is a bit of a problem, even though the whole thing is on wheels. I cut a popup. I used 1/2" plywood over 3/4" plywood (ripped into 3" widths) benchwork and legs and it is VERY heavy to roll acound, even on 2" ball casters. Hanging it would be tough. I'd use an electronic winch or at least a hand cranked one and cables. Using foam over an aluminum frame would be more expensive but probably worth it in the long run.
Show us some pics it when you get it in the air.
Doc
 
The more I think about it the more I think I should possibly just build a yard in two sections. Probably 2'x6' or so. Those would be realtively flat with the buildings removed and also light enough to handle. Then if they work out well I could build other sections. That way I would see how much they weigh and how sturdy they are. I don't think using really heavy plywood would work for me so it would have to be the under struture that provides the rigidity.

I really do like that original track plan though as it provides scenery options for most of what I want.

Also I won't be parking a car where the layout is very often so it can be down much of the time.

Here is are some links to hoistable layouts I have found that seemed to work well:

http://www.tghobby.com/story1a.htm

http://www.losalamos.com/tauxe/ho/
 
Unless you've got lots of room to walk around the outside of the layout, I'd strongly suggest you build a donut layout, one where you're in the middle and the layout is all around you.

Also, I'll second the 1/2" ply. 1/4 is way too flimsy. You could offset some of the weight by using 1x3s for the frame, or rip the frame members out of 1/2" or 3/4" ply.

Reach is going to be a very big issue, and I think you'd be better served by having a layout you can reach across than one you'd have to pop up and down like a whack-a-mole to fix stuff.
 
I also think your goals (while laudable) are a bit grandiose for the space you have.

Rather than try to encompass things that are half a continent away from each other (like MN ore docks and Puget Sound silos) why not try to focus on one end of the thing, and build the layout around that. I know 8x10 sounds like a lot, but believe me, it's not, once you start putting big structures like ore docks in there.
 
Being a builder I'll throw in my two cents: First how is your garage framed is it trusses, or stick framed, and can the joist handle the additional load. And as far as framework I would recommend a heavier frame versus sheeting, it's the torsional load you need to watch. You can overcome the weight with mechanical pullies as long as your joists can handle the weight. Just make sure the cables are designed to pull equal and evenly when hoisting. Garage ceilings are usually built on the lighter side of load capability. The open span needs to be taken into consideration when dealing with live loads.
 
As far as structure goes I am not really going to rely on the surface for much other than horizontal rigidity so I think 1/4 ply with foam glued to it will work. I am going to do some tests and calculations for the structure. I am a Mechanical Engineering student so I can figure this out. The track plan is my main issue.

This is what I am looking at now and I think it will probably work much better. Still needs lots of work and figuring the grades and elevation locations.

superiorironRangePtoPwithcontlinkbr.jpg


I am modifying the layout from the 101 layouts book.
 
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