HELP!! Rolling stock problem caught on video


C

csxgandn

Member
[video=youtube_share;JFghMKry-p4]https://youtu.be/JFghMKry-p4[/video]

In the video you will see the wheels come up off the rails. I'm not sure why this is happening. It only happens with these two boxcars and only when they are directly behind the locomotive (not when another car is between them and the loco). I thought it may be that the frog was too high so I filed it down and swapped out the turnout entirely but the problem persists. As far as I can tell this is the only place on the layout where it happens.

Anyone have any ideas what's going on. I'm just a beginner (as this post may have demonstrated) so any help would be appreciated.

Thanks
 
The coupler on the locomotive is too short, and it's dragging the car up and sometimes off the rails because there isn't enough pivotal motion in the coupler. You will need to use larger turnouts or longer couplers.
 
Thanks. I never would have thought of that. Is that why it only happens with these cars, which have longer couplers than the loco or my other cars?

Also, could I put shorter couplers on the boxcars?

Thanks
 
csxgandn said:
Thanks. I never would have thought of that. Is that why it only happens with these cars, which have longer couplers than the loco or my other cars?

Also, could I put shorter couplers on the boxcars?

Thanks
Click to expand...
Shorter couplers will make the problem worse. They need to be long enough to pivot for the reverse curve in the turnout.
 
Thanks. I'm in the beginning stages of building my layout and only have four cars. I planned to change all the couplers to Kadee (as it seems like the standard) at some point. I'm assuming they have something that will solve this problem.

Thanks. I'll try to get to the hobby store soon and see what they have!
 
Thanks, Willie. The coupler heights couldn't be any better to my eye so I'll do some research on the couplers you mentioned (thanks for the link).

I'm using #4 turnouts because of space restrictions, that is why I chose four axle locomotives and 50' max cars. I didn't know about the role couplers played. Thanks for the info, guys
 
csxgandn said:
I'm using #4 turnouts because of space restrictions,
Click to expand...
Also FYI - I can't tell for certain from the camera angle, but I think that is an Atlas "snap switch" rather than a #4. The snap-switches are closer to being a #3 turnout than a #4. They are designed to work with 18" radius trackage.
 
Iron Horseman said:
Also FYI - I can't tell for certain from the camera angle, but I think that is an Atlas "snap switch" rather than a #4. The snap-switches are closer to being a #3 turnout than a #4. They are designed to work with 18" radius trackage.
Click to expand...

You're right. The turnouts are Atlas code 83 snap switches. They are consistent with 18" radius curves. I thought that they were #4s. I'm learning all the time:)
 
csxgandn said:
The coupler heights couldn't be any better to my eye ....
Click to expand...

I would strongly recommend that if you invest in a Kadee coupler height gauge: #205, metal, about $7, or #206, plastic, about $6. Having both the coupler body and trip pin at the right goes a long way to improve operation.
 
To me there appears to be a bit of rocking going on as all the wheelsets cross the joint between the turnout's diverging track and the siding's rail. Make sure there isn't a high spot and dip at/near that joint. Another thing to check is that the coupler in the loco's coupler box has not had the securing screw over tightened. The coupler needs to have a free swinging play from side to side, and should re-center automatically. If you can't flick the coupler with your finger tip side to side and have it return to the center position, it's binding.
 
On a side note, I used to buy tire weights used for tire balancing, the kind that stick on. I would add a few over each set of trucks on every car just to give the car extra weight. It helped keep cars from misbehaving on some pieces of track. It's a different issue than what you have but the thought popped in my head so I figured I would share it.
 
One problem could be the weight of the car. One thing that I did notice was the length of the coupler on the locomotive. I have a problem once in a while with an SD-9 which has a fairly short shank on the coupler and quite a bit of tail swing compared to my other locomotives which occasionally causes derailments in similar situations.
 
Thanks for all the help, guys. Lots of info I didn't know! I will probably get to the store Sat. and try to resolve the issue.

I'll let you all know how I made out. More input anyone may have is still very welcome. Thanks again
 
Switchman:

Watching the video, when the cars and locomotive are in reverse, the lead boxcar's (now the second car) wheelset jumps just before entering the turnout. This leads me to believe the box cars and not the locomotive is the source of your problems. Especially since you said other rolling stock doesn't seem to have this problem.

I don't think the couplers on the locomotive are your source of the problem.

Did you check the tightness of the trucks and they pivot freely? Also, one truck should be "looser" than the other to help maintain wheel contact.

I would void the use Atlas Snap Switches since they are closer to a #3 than a #4 turnout. Atlas Custom Turnouts should work fine.

What brand are the two boxcars that are giving you the problems.

Thanks.

Greg

Keep us posted.
 
Greg@mnrr said:
Switchman:

Watching the video, when the cars and locomotive are in reverse, the lead boxcar's (now the second car) wheelset jumps just before entering the turnout. This leads me to believe the box cars and not the locomotive is the source of your problems. Especially since you said other rolling stock doesn't seem to have this problem.

I don't think the couplers on the locomotive are your source of the problem.

Did you check the tightness of the trucks and they pivot freely? Also, one truck should be "looser" than the other to help maintain wheel contact.

I would void the use Atlas Snap Switches since they are closer to a #3 than a #4 turnout. Atlas Custom Turnouts should work fine.

What brand are the two boxcars that are giving you the problems.

Thanks.

Greg

Keep us posted.
Click to expand...

Thanks, Greg. My other rolling stock doesn't have the issue, including a almost 60' hopper but with shorter coupler shanks. The boxcars are 50' but have longer coupler shanks. It only happens with the boxcars, that's true but more specifically it only happens to the boxcar which is directly behind the loco. That leads me to believe the loco may have something to do with it.

The boxcars are Atlas "Master Line", about $24 a piece, so middle of the road I guess.

I don't have any real cars weights but I did put something for weight on top of the cars to see what would happen...the boxcars no longer came off the rails but it seemed I saw the coupler of the loco rise a bit where the boxcar would have the issue! Not sure what's going on, I'm just a beginner but I appreciate all the help and suggestions from everybody.

I'll keep you posted after I get to the train store on Sat and hopefully get it resolved. At least it's a good excuse to go to the train store!

If any of this new info helps please keep the replies coming. Thanks, all!
 
If weight is a part of the problem, then follow the NMRA guidelines. For HO freight cars, it is 1 oz + 1/2 oz per 1" of car length. Thus a 50' boxcar which actually measures 7" should be 4 1/2 ozs (1 oz + 3 1/2 oz), or roughly 126 g in metric. I glue pennies inside enclosed cars as that is less expensive than buying stick-on weights. 10¢ = 1 oz approximately. OK, I know that you guys north of the border no longer have pennies so this only applies to USA!!!!
http://www.nmra.org/car-weight

Willie
 
Great info, Willie. Of course I'm not sure how much of the problem is weight but now I have the tools to check my cars' weights. That can't hurt! Also, love the "penny weights"

Thanks
 
Another weight to use is a steel nut. Since they come in all sizes, selecting the proper size is easy. I purchased a plastic container that ha many nuts of different sizes at the hardware store in the "bargain" table.

The nuts can be secured using double backed tape or glue.

Greg
 
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