design help

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irocinblue89

irocinblue89

Member
I have been trying to design a layout for the last year now :eek: and i think I am going about it all wrong. Part of me wants to ask for help, the other side thinks that if I can't come up with it then to bad. I completely suck when it comes to designing something. I usually just start building and end up with something close to what I was thinking. Now that being said, I think the space is to large for me to do that, plus I usually spend more money on my projects by winging it than if i was to go by a design. I think I will spend way to much money by doing that so I would like someone to help me with a rough design. I have tried xtrackcad but like I said I'm more of a builder than a designer. Maybe someone that is good at it or likes to do it can give me a hand. I would like to give away a loco or something in return for their time. I have a few I will be putting on HOYS soon. I'm out of options. Anyone interested?

Thank you,
Seann
 
Asking for help on layout design is part of the hobby, and these forums. There are a lot of great experienced modeler who are willing to help you with your design. No need for something in return. I received a lot of help here when I started my first layout just over a year ago.

You need to give us detailed information about what you are trying to accomplish. You need to come up with a list of Givens/Druthers (or Must Haves/Would like to have).

What is the space available for the layout, including doors/windows/obstructions. A drawing of the space with dimensions and post a pic of it here.

What scale? HO or N
What era? Steam/Diesel late/modern
What RR are you trying to model? (Prototype) or Freelanced Fantasy Layout
What area/location of the railroad are you wanting to model?
What type of operations of the layout? Continuous mainline running or Point-to-Point industry/yard switching.
What type of scenery do you want to model? Bridges, Tunnels, Mountains, Rivers, Lakes, Downtown buildings, farms.
What Industries do you want to model? Coal Mines, Lumber Mills/Logging, Grain, Oil, Freight.

Also other things like DC or DCC, what type of track and switches. How do you plan to control the switches like manual ground throws or remote control with DCC switch machines.

Good luck with your new fun in the hobby, I'm sure you'll get plenty of help here from the experts.

Also I recommend you purchase a copy of a book called Track Planning for Realistic Operations by John Armstrong http://www.amazon.com/Track-Planning-Realistic-Operation-Railroader/dp/0890242275/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1293638033&sr=8-1-spell
 
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Thanks for the boost. I HATE to ask for help. I actually built benchwork twice in the basement but looking at it I hate it. I was going to make the trackplan fit the benchwork and all I ended up was wasting time and money. I'm at work right now but i did draw the floorplan on a large piece of paper. The best i can do is take a pic of that and post it. I couldn't even get that done correctly on xtrackcad.
 


It sounds like your not too kindly on xtracad, like me LOL. Just use Atlas RTS it's much easier to learn quickly with it.

Also it helps if you draw the dimensions with the 12" square grids visible, and post that up for everyone to see.
 
I get frustrated with computers very easily, so I do all my planning with a good mechanical pencil and copy paper. Graph paper's even better if you're drawing to scale.

So, you have no benchwork design in mind, only the shape of your room. This gives you a lot of design freedom.

What is it that you like about model railroading? Some people prefer the logic puzzles of switching, and make layouts with all kinds of industries, spurs, and switches (to the point of what has been called "basket weaving with nickel silver"). Others are more into running long passenger trains and freights along main lines. Still others (actually I think most of us) like a combination thereof, allowing for continuous running but with some switching to give it purpose.

Just sit down with a pad of paper and scribble down a few ideas, sketches, whatever, of setups you like. Position a few models and buildings (Kleenex boxes make great temporary buildings btw :)) and get a feel for what sort thing you're into, what feel you want for scenes, whatever. Check out pictures of other models, or real railroads, and if you see something that you really like, make a note of it.

Also check out others' track plans. Model Railroader articles are great for this, and there are loads of books on track plans.

Nobody gets the perfect track plan the first time they sit down. Sketch out something you like, post it up, let us rip on it a bit, and chances are you'll come out with something you like. I posted up my attempt at a track plan a while back and got some great feedback that allowed me to improve it dramatically.

There's nothing wrong with asking for help. That's what forums are for. :)
 
I just spent 6 hrs doing a floorplan on xtrack CAD and I cant even get it to upload. I'm going to have to read on how to upload that. I hate technology.:D
 
Motley:
I picked up 102 track plans, Track Planning for Realistic Operations, and basic bench work books.
Answers to some of your questions: HO Scale, Multideck, No particular era, Long trains, Large engines, Freelanced Fantasy Layout, Mountains, Continuous mainline running, scenery - [Bridges, Tunnels, Mountains, and Rivers], Mixed freight, and Coal (I have 160 coal cars), DCC, I will do it in flex track and either atlas or hand made switches, Ground throws in easy to reach areas but mostly switch machines.

Must Haves:
#1 Yard
#2 Double Main line (at least)
#3 Helix or Nolix
#4 Round House and Turntable (not necessarily at the yard)
#5 City (small)

Wishlist:
#1 An "in & out " yard
#2 Passing Sidings
#3 A place where I might need helpers
#4 Coal Mine
#5 Over and Under
#6 A Long and Tall Bridge coming out of a Tunnel
 
I cant follow that pic very well It looks like you have space for you layout at the top and then a walkway before the large section at the bottom? If thats the case you have lots of room for everthing you want. My opinion is to build the layout about 3' off all the walls and use islands no deeper than 6' so that you can reach the track from either sides. This will give you the most room for track,and still be able to reach every thing. put the helix at a end that will not see lots of view.
.Now is the time to chouse a era. steam?, diesel?, transistion? modern?
It helps to do this now not at the 1/2 way point. this will also set you up for what you need to buy for scenery and structures. IMO dont use atlas snap switchs. I always trace out my track plan on paper and adjust it as I go. Never been into the computer plans as they always change when the build starts. build the layout for function. 2 track mains are nice but sidings are fun too. when you build sidings make them the same length so trains can always pass each other.
 
Sounds like a fun setup. If you want to go with really big engines, I'd recommend transition-era Union Pacific, mostly because of the photo below. That's a Veranda Turbine lashed to a Challenger. I'm not sure if the UP did coal, but in your universe, why not? :)

I'm assuming that the space with the scratch marks is where you want to put trains? If it is, you'll have some reach problems (especially multi-deck!). Most multi deck layouts are shelf-style, sticking out a few feet around the walls. If the bit in the middle is a wall, you could run it around the other walls, drill through that one (massive tunnel!) and have one location in either room (so that you're bringing trains from somewhere, to somewhere). If you're feeling adventurous you could even do different seasons in different rooms. (Maybe one room is at a higher altitude, and snowy, while in the other room it's lower and still fall.)

You'll need a sort of bump at either end to fit in the helix. Perhaps you could put the coal mine on one of these. While mainline trains go behind it, to the helix, you could have a Geep of some variety filling hoppers with coal, to be delivered to a nearby yard and added to the larger trains as they come through.

You didn't mention passenger service, but if you're including a town, why not throw a big station in there? Passenger trains can be pretty massive, and would add a lot to operations imo.

I can certainly see a multi-track main line in there, with some double-ended yards, helixes between the decks, a servicing facility/roundhouse, etc. Sounds great to me. :D
 


Actually the space with the hash marks are where I'm not allowed. I left the part for trains blank so track can be drawn in. As far as era I love steam but, I also have alot of conrails (32 of them). I have 3 bigboys, a Challenger, a 4-12-2, a Y6b, a turbine, an A-B-B-A ATSF passenger train with 20 cars. I LOVE to go big. The space on the other side of the wall screams helix on the right and yard on the left. But I can't figure out how to tie it all in. I think I have writers block. Bad thing is is the more I sit on it the more "she" keeps bugging me about a spare bedroom in that space.:eek:
 
o.k so I took a few picks to give you guys a little better idea of what I was talking about. It's a mess but compared to the remodel projects I'm doing upstairs i think it looks pretty clean. :D
 
Oh I didn't know you made that much progress!

The benchwork looks fine to me, I'm sure you/we can come up with a nice track plan to fit your benchwork so you don't have to start over.

Could you post an xtracad pic of the benchwork?
 
The benchwork is temporary. I really wanted a multi deck layout. I whipped that up so I could run some trains with the boy and work on them. For some reason I really don't like the looks or the feel of it. It kinda reminds me of an oversized 4x8.
 
Motley said:
Oh I didn't know you made that much progress!

The benchwork looks fine to me, I'm sure you/we can come up with a nice track plan to fit your benchwork so you don't have to start over.
Click to expand...

+1

That benchwork looks like a pretty good start to me as well - Hopefully you haven't torn it all apart - Yet! - "We'll" give you plenty of help to do that if really required!..... Having said that, you did it as a single deck rather than your desired double decker so we'll really need to see what you've got there already.

Glad you're overcoming your hatred of technology! First thing I'd note is computers *know* when you get upset and call them evil! - You've gotta be nice to 'em! :)

FWIW, I'm currently in the same (frustrated!) mode with Xtrackcad, but I am slowly making progress - In fact, laying out the benchwork is one of the "easier" tasks (at least it was for me!) - Set up your room size first then draw in the benchwork.

Good luck, as already noted there are many here who will help and criticize what you're up to.

Cheers,
Ian
 
I wont argue that the benchwork could stay, but the track isn't even nailed down and it's on leftover OSB from the barn build and other projects. Which is just sitting on top. I was under the impression that you design the track and then build your benchwork to support it? As far as xtrak right now with the kitchen remodel I'm doing I will never have the time to draw it. It literally took me almost 6hrs to draw the room and get it uploaded. I am not giving up yet but "no time to draw on the computer" she says.
 
I would put a Helix close to the center of the main room and one in the upper left hand corner of the main room. The layout would look like a "G" rotated 90 deg counterclockwise.

Starting from the helix in the upper left hand corner it would run along the outside wall until it got near the door, then it would bend down into the center of the room and join the helix in the middle of the room. You should have enough room to put 24-30" wide benchwork in for lots of scenery.

You haven't drawn where the door or stairway is to access this space. I am assuming that it is somewhere in the "hallway" along the top. If the access is at the end of the long narrow hallway you really can't use up more than about 6" of that space or you will block it. Maybe a long industrial or mine branch. Similarly the space in the upper right, if the acces point is through there it can possibly limit its usefulness , but it also has the possibility of a mining branch coming through the wall at grid point 33 with one branch curving along the outside wall and another branch curving along the divider wall.
 
Why don't you just download Atlas RTS and call it a day. It's very easy to use, it's important we get the correct format of the benchwork to see what we have to work with. I'm sure most of it can be used, and just replace sections of it for the new plan.
 


Motley: This going to be hard to believe but I don't have internet at home. I am doing all of this from my phone except for the xtrak. I worked it up last night saved it, surfed on my phone on how to upload it. Changed the format on the computer, downloaded it to my phone and posted it with my phone. I live out in the country so the phone reception is average at best and downloading a program would be a huge undertaking. I will see if I have some extra time after working on the kitchen (which I'm doing after work) to get the benchwork on xtrak oor something. Heck maybe I could talk my son into getting g into the program. It would be easier for him anyways.
 
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