Ways to get an Amtrak P42 in phase V?

[Prime12]

I want one in phase V scheme but as I know it hasn't been available since a brief limited run last year. They do pop on ebay from time to time but more often than not they fetch ridiculous prices or I don't get to win the bid.

Any tips on obtaining these? Can I get an earlier scheme and order the shell separately or something?

 

[TMLW]

Could always paint one. Microscale makes the decals for it.

 

[Prime12]

hey now you are talking to someone who can barely avoid running paint with a rattle can

 

[diburning]

Well, like you, I missed out and had to pay a slight fortune for one ($120 for one). The LHS had them for $77.98 but has since been sold out. I've heard a rumor that Walthers has since cancelled the contract with Athearn so that Athearn cannot make any more P42s in Phase V (not sure how much truth there is in that rumor though).

They rarely go on ebay for under $130 these days.

 

[roadrunner]

Do a long search on yahoo. I did about 3 months ago and found one right here in Oh for $99. I know there were at least 2 more shops that still had one. I went thru probably 10 or more of the search pages and called every shop that listed one. : I believe Athearn can no longer make them because of Licensing with Walthers .

 

[jbaakko]

The run of P42's last year was actually the FIFTH edition. Walthers seems to run them about every year & a half to two years. Walthers has a licensing agreement with Amtrak for that paint scheme, thus why Athearn P42's are sold exclusively by Walthers in that scheme.

 

[diburning]

Athearn also retooled them slightly somewhere along the way. The newer ones have actual coupler pockets that aren't slots in the metal frame. However, they still haven't fixed the low coupler height problem nor have they changed the way the shell mounts to the chassis (with those unsightly tabs)

Otherwise, they're really nice engines.

 

[Southwest Chief]

Two are in the works as Walthers list two new Athean P42s. No road numbers announced yet.

Some rumors these might feature the new 40th anniversary heritage schemes like phase III on P42 #145:

However with a March release, I doubt very much these two new P42s will be in anything other than phase V.

Here is a link to the two new P42s from Walthers:

New Walthers/Athearn P42s



And as to Amtrak licensing;

Walthers has the exclusive right on Amtrak paint schemes for anything post phase IV. And that includes any "new" schemes which the heritage scheme will technically fall under. Kato possibly has the rights or licensed the rights from Walthers to do their N scale Amtrak phase V and IVb. The Microscale decal set is unofficially licensed. I believe they have since licensed or contracted with Walthers, but it is a bit iffy from what I've heard. The O scale and (LGB G scale) phase V offerings may be licensed or not via Walthers, never have heard anything on these.

 

[diburning]

AFAIK, Walthers does not own the rights to the heritage schemes (not yet at least) so Athearn may release them at any time they please without interference from Walthers. (unless of course, Walthers decides to screw with Athearn and nab the rights to the heritage schemes as well)

Does anyone know the exact terms as to the licensing contract between Walthers and Amtrak?

 

[diburning]

And honestly, I don't think Microscale needs to get their licensing from Walthers. Microscale makes decals, Athearn makes models. And if anything, Microscale can make a decal set to amend a past-release Athearn Phase 3 P42DC for modelers to create a heritage loco.

 

[jbaakko]

Amtrak #1 & #67, due in October 2011. Just got a pre-order noticed from Overland Models Inc.

Go figure they'd do up #1 this time around. It was in my planned "to be painted" on an Undec P42. I guess it now goes in the "to be ordered" box.

As for the license, Walthers ONLY has an exclusive license for Phase V (the current P42 scheme), and it only applies to HO scale, seemingly P42's. Decals are available, Bachmann Acela units use the Acela version of the Phase V scheme, Kato uses the Phase V scheme on N scale, ect...

 

[Southwest Chief]

And honestly, I don't think Microscale needs to get their licensing from Walthers.

You'd think that. As did I, until I talked with someone in the industry. Don't want to go into too many details as it was confidential info. And only applies to the most recent Amtrak paint schemes. Essentially everything after Amtrak and Walthers made their agreement.

That's why I think the new heritage paint sheme will fall under that agreement since it technically is new.

Notice there's no Amtrak California, Surfliner, or IVb from Microscale even though they are hit with requests for these all the time. Hmmmm

We are very lucky to have the P42 phase V decal set.

And yes forgot about Bachmann. They licensed the Acela scheme and variants. Atlas also has an agreement to do various phase V paint schemes.

These licensing agreements are quite complex and just end up hurting the hobby with higher costs and prices (UPS anyone?). But that is my opinion, which should be saved for another discussion topic.

 

[TMLW]

Notice there's no Amtrak California, Surfliner, or IVb from Microscale even though they are hit with requests for these all the time. Hmmmm

I've noticed this. I did find decals for the cars though, just not the engines. Both are projects that I am currently looking into building. It will have to involve custom decals for the engines I'm afraid.

 

[diburning]

You'd think that. As did I, until I talked with someone in the industry. Don't want to go into too many details as it was confidential info. And only applies to the most recent Amtrak paint schemes. Essentially everything after Amtrak and Walthers made their agreement.

That's why I think the new heritage paint sheme will fall under that agreement since it technically is new.

Notice there's no Amtrak California, Surfliner, or IVb from Microscale even though they are hit with requests for these all the time. Hmmmm

We are very lucky to have the P42 phase V decal set.

And yes forgot about Bachmann. They licensed the Acela scheme and variants. Atlas also has an agreement to do various phase V paint schemes.

These licensing agreements are quite complex and just end up hurting the hobby with higher costs and prices (UPS anyone?). But that is my opinion, which should be saved for another discussion topic.

Here's my reasoning for why Microscale doesn't need licensing. I may be wrong, but this is a logical theory.

I own a blackberry phone. Now, I can either buy the case that Blackberry made for it, or I can buy a case from a different manufacturer. Now, I can also get a case at the dollar store. I don't think that the case manufacturers paid any licensing fees to use the name of the product (Blackberry 9700) on their packaging because they're not making the phone, they're making the accessory.

So, this would be similar. Microscale doesn't make the models, Microscale makes the accessory decals.

Also, Atlas makes the Phase V Dash 8-32BHWs. They do not say Walthers or Amtrak licensed product. The locos were announced in 2008, which by that time, Walthers had already had the licensing agreement with Amtrak. If they have some sort of agreement, then they're not making it public.

But unless theres some public or revealed contract between Walthers and Amtrak, we're all just arguing what we think is the case. In any case, time will tell. If Athearn does do the anniversary paint scheme, then we'll see whether it's Ready to Roll or Athearn Collectibles.

 

[LATX]

Atlas Phase V locos didn't last that long neither and there new realeses are in Phase III "pepsi cans" scheme. Its upsetting because now i got to hunt them down

 

[diburning]

Have you seen the recent announcements? They're making more in the Pepsi can scheme

 

[LATX]

Have you seen the recent announcements? They're making more in the Pepsi can scheme

i have but its phase III. I need a Phase IV and Phase V