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The #5s will work in Athearn engines and newer engines from other brands. The #5s will not work in the tyco cars although Kadee has a conversion kit for those.
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Motley
Active Member
I say get that Digitrax Zepher, it should last you quite a while. If you get the Bachman, and decide later you need a features like extra function buttons or programming CVs. It's not overkill at all.
And then buy some good quality locos that you want. Most DCC ready locos can be had for less than $80. And then you can install a non-sound decoder for like $20.
If you want sound, (all my locos have sound) you can get one with DCC & Sound for about $200.
Good luck, report back with pics!
And then buy some good quality locos that you want. Most DCC ready locos can be had for less than $80. And then you can install a non-sound decoder for like $20.
If you want sound, (all my locos have sound) you can get one with DCC & Sound for about $200.
Good luck, report back with pics!
diburning
AlcoHaulic
The Digitrax can do 4 digit addresses (so that you can set the decoder's number to the locomotive number) while the Bachmann can only do #1-9. The Zephyr can program more CVs in more modes (paged, direct, hex, ops) which some brands of locomotives/decoders need. (bachmann's system has limited programing capability)
The Bachmann is 1 amp, while the Zephyr is 2.5 amps (run more locomotives at once, run sound equipped locomotives, etc)
The Bachmann is 1 amp, while the Zephyr is 2.5 amps (run more locomotives at once, run sound equipped locomotives, etc)
Look what i'm a new owner of. A little more than I wanted to spend but it should get me started. Now I need a few DCC loco's.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...si=jFhigW4KRfNgBX43yDQUUF0%2BJLw%3D&viewitem=
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...si=jFhigW4KRfNgBX43yDQUUF0%2BJLw%3D&viewitem=
mydartswinger
Member
Congrats on your new Zephyr. It's an excellent system. You won't regret the purchase. The advanced programming is a blessing. Once you get your system up and running, you may get to a point where you want to run multiple engine trains. With the Zephyr you can set up a consist to do so by selecting the address of the engine you want to run it with, then adding the addresses of the engines you want to be a part of the consist. You'll find that locomotives will differ in running capabilities, causing some issues if you want to just set the consist and go. This is where the advanced programming comes in. You can change the decoders to slow down your faster locos and closely match their performance, making for a more enjoyable consist.
My layout is only a 4x8, and the Zephyr has allowed me to do what I want with the layout. I've already surpassed the limits of the Bachmann system by running 5 engines at a time (4 in a consist, plus 1 additional engine). Using the Zephyr, you can also program your sound decoder (changing volumes, changing preloaded sounds, when/how certain sounds activate, etc...) once you get into sound.
Since you have several older engines, I would recommend installing a 3 way switch to allow you to use both the Zephyr and your old DC controllers without rewiring the layout when you want to switch. Though the Zephyr does provide a provision for running DC engines using address 00, many of the older engines don't run well using this option (if they run at all). If you just want to test or run an older engine, using the 3 switch, you can just flip it from your DCC to your DC and run the single engine. I've done this on my layout and it works well for those older Tyco/Life-Like type engines.
Good luck
My layout is only a 4x8, and the Zephyr has allowed me to do what I want with the layout. I've already surpassed the limits of the Bachmann system by running 5 engines at a time (4 in a consist, plus 1 additional engine). Using the Zephyr, you can also program your sound decoder (changing volumes, changing preloaded sounds, when/how certain sounds activate, etc...) once you get into sound.
Since you have several older engines, I would recommend installing a 3 way switch to allow you to use both the Zephyr and your old DC controllers without rewiring the layout when you want to switch. Though the Zephyr does provide a provision for running DC engines using address 00, many of the older engines don't run well using this option (if they run at all). If you just want to test or run an older engine, using the 3 switch, you can just flip it from your DCC to your DC and run the single engine. I've done this on my layout and it works well for those older Tyco/Life-Like type engines.
Good luck
Thanks, I'll look into the 3-way switch. Is there a specific one for model RRing I should be looking for? I'm also looking to getting 2 inexpensive starter DCC locomotives. Is there a place anyone can recommend? I'm looking on eBay and they're all right around the $50 mark, i've seen a few in the $40's but they don't specify if there DCC or not so i'm assuming they're not. I just don't want to over pay is all. Thanks.
mydartswinger
Member
The 3 way switch that I used is a DPDT toggle switch from Radio Shack (part # 275-664). Not sure about the used market, but you can find new DCC equipped locos from Bachmann starting at a little over $70. These are going to be very basic locomotives, likely bordering on toylike. You can get a good running, nicely detailed Athearn diesel for about $100 (new). They come with a "quick plug" (if specified, a few don't have them. The listing or box should say if it does or not), allowing you to just plug the decoder (about $20-$30 without sound) into the slot and it's ready to go on address 03 (always test the decoder install using this address before changing the address).
Most any retailer should have them. If you have a local hobby shop, check them out. Sometimes they have used stuff as well.
Here's a couple of distributors to check out:
Walthers:
http://www.walthers.com/
Horizon Hobby:
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Trains/
Most any retailer should have them. If you have a local hobby shop, check them out. Sometimes they have used stuff as well.
Here's a couple of distributors to check out:
Walthers:
http://www.walthers.com/
Horizon Hobby:
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Trains/
***UPDATE***
I just got home not to long ago with 4 boxes of goodies. Track, few buildings, locomotives and rolling stock, and some odds and ends.
Everything is dusty and needs a good cleaning but that was to be expected, I was a little disappointed with the amount of rolling stock. I thought I had alot but it looks like I only have about 20 cars total. I have 4 locomotives and only 3 work but i'm ordering 2 DCC loco's tonight. I have a few buildings, nothing with great detail, these I think were from 1993, 1994.
As far as the layout goes we got it taken apart so now its in 2 4x8 sheets, my dad made a screwed together unit out of the 2 sections using the legs so it will fit in the back of my truck without much hassle. I just hope the weather corporates this week, the plan right now is to get it Tuesday.
Would this be a good way to go about redoing all the coupler's on my old rolling stock? All mine have the horn hooks on them.
http://cgi.ebay.com/Kadee-HO-Knuckl...808569?pt=Model_RR_Trains&hash=item4155e2e9b9
I just got home not to long ago with 4 boxes of goodies. Track, few buildings, locomotives and rolling stock, and some odds and ends.
Everything is dusty and needs a good cleaning but that was to be expected, I was a little disappointed with the amount of rolling stock. I thought I had alot but it looks like I only have about 20 cars total. I have 4 locomotives and only 3 work but i'm ordering 2 DCC loco's tonight. I have a few buildings, nothing with great detail, these I think were from 1993, 1994.
As far as the layout goes we got it taken apart so now its in 2 4x8 sheets, my dad made a screwed together unit out of the 2 sections using the legs so it will fit in the back of my truck without much hassle. I just hope the weather corporates this week, the plan right now is to get it Tuesday.
Would this be a good way to go about redoing all the coupler's on my old rolling stock? All mine have the horn hooks on them.
http://cgi.ebay.com/Kadee-HO-Knuckl...808569?pt=Model_RR_Trains&hash=item4155e2e9b9
Last edited by a moderator:
mydartswinger
Member
Glad to hear you got some of the stuff home now. Not to mention a nice little collection to start off with. This is when the fun really starts.
I recognize a couple of the freight cars you have. The "Virginian" hopper, what looks to be a "Tropicana" box car, and what looks to be a "Heinz" box car. If that's the case, those are likely Tyco "brown box" cars. If they are, in fact, the Tyco cars, they will have the couplers mounted to the trucks.
Those are a bit of a difficult conversion. I recently acquired a few from my father and made an attempt at converting them. The result was a lot of derailments and uncouplings due to loose couplers that wouldn't return to center after a turn.
The currently installed couplers should work fine with what you already have. I would save the conversions for chassis and/or body mount couplers.
As for actual coupler selection, those that you have listed (they are the #5 couplers with a medium center shank. Most locomotives and rolling stock use these.) are a good baseline coupler. However, each application may require a different coupler (IE: some require a long underset shank, others require a short overset shank, etc...).
To determine if you need a center, offset, or inverse offset shank, a coupler height gauge comes in very handy. Kadee also has a chart listing the part numbers for each coupler type. Here's Kadee's listing for them:
Height Gauge
http://www.kadee.com/htmbord/page205.htm
Coupler Chart:
http://www.kadee.com/htmbord/HO-Scale%20Couplers.htm
It's always good to have several of each type on hand. This will allow you to test fit each type of coupler you may need (though the chart will give you a base idea of which coupler you need). Start with the #5, then check your coupler height. If the coupler is dead on, no further action is needed (except for bending the air hoses up if they don't clear the base of the gauge). If the coupler is above, you need an overset shank. If the coupler is below, you need an underset shank. The length of the shank will depend on how far underneath the car/loco the coupler box(coupler mount) is. Once you know the shank type you need, then you can reference the chart for the part number.
Short answer to your question IMHO:
It'll be a good idea to have those couplers on hand, and bulk is the cheapest way to get them. However, save them for your new locos and rolling stock as you acquire them unless it's a chassis or body mount coupler.
Enjoy,
Shannon
I recognize a couple of the freight cars you have. The "Virginian" hopper, what looks to be a "Tropicana" box car, and what looks to be a "Heinz" box car. If that's the case, those are likely Tyco "brown box" cars. If they are, in fact, the Tyco cars, they will have the couplers mounted to the trucks.
Those are a bit of a difficult conversion. I recently acquired a few from my father and made an attempt at converting them. The result was a lot of derailments and uncouplings due to loose couplers that wouldn't return to center after a turn.
The currently installed couplers should work fine with what you already have. I would save the conversions for chassis and/or body mount couplers.
As for actual coupler selection, those that you have listed (they are the #5 couplers with a medium center shank. Most locomotives and rolling stock use these.) are a good baseline coupler. However, each application may require a different coupler (IE: some require a long underset shank, others require a short overset shank, etc...).
To determine if you need a center, offset, or inverse offset shank, a coupler height gauge comes in very handy. Kadee also has a chart listing the part numbers for each coupler type. Here's Kadee's listing for them:
Height Gauge
http://www.kadee.com/htmbord/page205.htm
Coupler Chart:
http://www.kadee.com/htmbord/HO-Scale%20Couplers.htm
It's always good to have several of each type on hand. This will allow you to test fit each type of coupler you may need (though the chart will give you a base idea of which coupler you need). Start with the #5, then check your coupler height. If the coupler is dead on, no further action is needed (except for bending the air hoses up if they don't clear the base of the gauge). If the coupler is above, you need an overset shank. If the coupler is below, you need an underset shank. The length of the shank will depend on how far underneath the car/loco the coupler box(coupler mount) is. Once you know the shank type you need, then you can reference the chart for the part number.
Short answer to your question IMHO:
It'll be a good idea to have those couplers on hand, and bulk is the cheapest way to get them. However, save them for your new locos and rolling stock as you acquire them unless it's a chassis or body mount coupler.
Enjoy,
Shannon
diburning
AlcoHaulic
Well, most of those cars are toys and you'll have problems with them. Truck mounted couplers, light cars, and plastic wheels = recipe for disaster!
In the photo directly above this post, you have an Athearn car which is decent.
To have the best running qualities for your cars, these three are a must:
1. Metal Kadee couplers - Metal couplers are durable and the shank won't twist like plastic ones do if you have a long train. There's the "standard" Kadee #5 or the #58 scale head coupler (the scale head coupler is less tolerant of rough trackwork)
2. Metal Wheels - Plastic wheels leave a residue on the tracks that is a pain to clean off. Metal wheels reduce drag and add weight to the car. Intermountain wheels are the ones that most people use. Wheels come in 4 sizes, 28", 33", 36", and 38"
3. Proper weight - The NMRA recommended practice is to measure the car, from coupler to coupler, divide the measurement (in inches) by two, add one, and that's how much the car should weigh in total ounces. They make stick-on weights for the cars, but if you have nuts and washers or anything laying around, you can glue those down to the inside of the car. Glue the weights down over the trucks (try to distribute them evenly) so that the car doesn't wobble as much.
When you get Kadee couplers, coupler height may be an issue with some brands/models. Get a Kadee height gauge, and some fiber washers. The washers can be used to shim the car up at the bolsters to raise coupler height. To lower coupler height, you'll can buy Kadee offset shank couplers (they came in short, medium, long, underset, centerset, and overset) to raise or lower coupler height as well as provide clearances.
I've noticed that you put a wanted ad for DCC locomotives. Most locomotives can be converted to DCC with the installation of a DCC decoder. Most modern engines come with a DCC socket where you just plug in a decoder and go. With the ones that don't installation requires a soldering iron although the installtion is easy. (solder in 7 wires)
In the photo directly above this post, you have an Athearn car which is decent.
To have the best running qualities for your cars, these three are a must:
1. Metal Kadee couplers - Metal couplers are durable and the shank won't twist like plastic ones do if you have a long train. There's the "standard" Kadee #5 or the #58 scale head coupler (the scale head coupler is less tolerant of rough trackwork)
2. Metal Wheels - Plastic wheels leave a residue on the tracks that is a pain to clean off. Metal wheels reduce drag and add weight to the car. Intermountain wheels are the ones that most people use. Wheels come in 4 sizes, 28", 33", 36", and 38"
3. Proper weight - The NMRA recommended practice is to measure the car, from coupler to coupler, divide the measurement (in inches) by two, add one, and that's how much the car should weigh in total ounces. They make stick-on weights for the cars, but if you have nuts and washers or anything laying around, you can glue those down to the inside of the car. Glue the weights down over the trucks (try to distribute them evenly) so that the car doesn't wobble as much.
When you get Kadee couplers, coupler height may be an issue with some brands/models. Get a Kadee height gauge, and some fiber washers. The washers can be used to shim the car up at the bolsters to raise coupler height. To lower coupler height, you'll can buy Kadee offset shank couplers (they came in short, medium, long, underset, centerset, and overset) to raise or lower coupler height as well as provide clearances.
I've noticed that you put a wanted ad for DCC locomotives. Most locomotives can be converted to DCC with the installation of a DCC decoder. Most modern engines come with a DCC socket where you just plug in a decoder and go. With the ones that don't installation requires a soldering iron although the installtion is easy. (solder in 7 wires)
Last edited by a moderator:
Thanks, most of my rolling stock is pretty rough so the plan is to replace it after some time. But there are few that I do want to keep as they have sentimental value. That Athearn car was part of a set I got at Toys R Us when I was a kid, most of the other stuff my cousin gave me one year which I thought would be the better stuff since his dad collected most of it. Other than height being an issue would the #5 couplers work on my stuff?
Thanks for the info about the DCC Conversion of older locomotives. I have one that I know I want to convert for sure and soldering is no problem.
Thanks for the info about the DCC Conversion of older locomotives. I have one that I know I want to convert for sure and soldering is no problem.
mydartswinger
Member
Definitely convert the ones like in post #56 (your Athearn cars). That coupler box is fine. You may be able to get away with converting the ones like in the last photo in post #55, providing that you can pull the mounting pin out and put it back in it's place securely once the coupler has been replaced.
I have made a few attempts at converting the ones like those in the second picture in post #55. It doesn't work out too well. There may be a way to do it, but I'm not familiar with it. I ran into 2 issues in trying to convert these. The first is that the pin that the coupler slides onto is very small. Kadee does provide a little adapter with their couplers to fill the extra space. However, this leads into issue #2. There is no easily serviceable coupler box like there is on the Athearn. The coupler is held in place by the plastic that is molded around it, leaving the space over the mounting pin and nothing to hold the adapter in place.
On those that you can convert, take at least one of those and leave the hook coupler on one end. Best bet would be to only only convert the Athearn car on one end, and do not convert anything else unless you have more Athearn cars. If you do, convert both sides on all but one car and run those at the front, running the hook style coupler equipped cars behind them. This gives you a "conversion car", allowing you to run cars with both style couplers. However, like diburning said, those cars are troublesome to run.
I do understand the sentimental value of them. I have a few like that myself.
Decent rolling stock can be found in kit form for $10-$15 for most cars. These are good cars once the wheelsets are upgraded to metal and are weighted. The coupler boxes on them are much easier to work with than those on most of you older rolling stock.
Bachmann does make some toylike cars that cost around $8 a car RTR (ready to run). However, the screws tend to strip out the plastic very easy. The cars are also very lightweight and the couplers knuckle style, but are weak plastic. Their light weight makes them derail more easily.
Decent rolling stock that are good candidates for Kadee couplers can be had for around $20-$30 new RTR.
I have made a few attempts at converting the ones like those in the second picture in post #55. It doesn't work out too well. There may be a way to do it, but I'm not familiar with it. I ran into 2 issues in trying to convert these. The first is that the pin that the coupler slides onto is very small. Kadee does provide a little adapter with their couplers to fill the extra space. However, this leads into issue #2. There is no easily serviceable coupler box like there is on the Athearn. The coupler is held in place by the plastic that is molded around it, leaving the space over the mounting pin and nothing to hold the adapter in place.
On those that you can convert, take at least one of those and leave the hook coupler on one end. Best bet would be to only only convert the Athearn car on one end, and do not convert anything else unless you have more Athearn cars. If you do, convert both sides on all but one car and run those at the front, running the hook style coupler equipped cars behind them. This gives you a "conversion car", allowing you to run cars with both style couplers. However, like diburning said, those cars are troublesome to run.
I do understand the sentimental value of them. I have a few like that myself.
Decent rolling stock can be found in kit form for $10-$15 for most cars. These are good cars once the wheelsets are upgraded to metal and are weighted. The coupler boxes on them are much easier to work with than those on most of you older rolling stock.
Bachmann does make some toylike cars that cost around $8 a car RTR (ready to run). However, the screws tend to strip out the plastic very easy. The cars are also very lightweight and the couplers knuckle style, but are weak plastic. Their light weight makes them derail more easily.
Decent rolling stock that are good candidates for Kadee couplers can be had for around $20-$30 new RTR.
diburning
AlcoHaulic
The #5s will work in Athearn engines and newer engines from other brands. The #5s will not work in the tyco cars although Kadee has a conversion kit for those.
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