Looking for PRR X29 boxcars

[Orange Irish]

I just bought three Athearn 40' PRR X29 boxcars and they are just fine except the paint seems just a little pale. It doesn't come close to the shade of oxide red on a MTH reefer and caboose from the same era.

Athearn - http://www.trainworldonline.com/cat...rtr-40-ysd-box-prrshadow-keystone-30689-70067

MTH - http://www.trainworldonline.com/cat...s/pennsylvania-40-steel-sided-reefer-85-78011

Is one shade more accurate than the other? Are there more or better choices out there for PRR X29 boxcars? Thanks!

 

[PaulB]

I just bought three Athearn 40' PRR X29 boxcars and they are just fine except the paint seems just a little pale. It doesn't come close to the shade of oxide red on a MTH reefer and caboose from the same era.

Athearn - http://www.trainworldonline.com/cat...rtr-40-ysd-box-prrshadow-keystone-30689-70067

MTH - http://www.trainworldonline.com/cat...s/pennsylvania-40-steel-sided-reefer-85-78011

Is one shade more accurate than the other? Are there more or better choices out there for PRR X29 boxcars? Thanks!

I would think that the lighter cars could represent faded paintwork. In the real world paint fades due to the elements.

There was a big debate about the right shade of brunswick green on the athearn PRR GP7's a while ago. Many thought the Athearn shade was too green, as the PRR locos looked almost black when straight out of the paint shops. Over time their paint faded to a more greenie colour, and so others argued the athearn shade was ok for a loco that had been out and about for some time. I guess boxcars would be the same.

 

[tootnkumin]

On this forum there is a question about the same Box cars with a link to some models done by a Tim Muir. You'll have to register to see them, (I didn't) so not sure how good the link is.

Here's another from RRPicturesArchives
http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/rsPicture.aspx?id=365443
also another http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/rsPicture.aspx?id=527625
and this one too http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/rsPicture.aspx?id=429914
Quite some variations as you'll see

Sorry I lost the link to that first one, oops

Here's a walthers one nicely weathered to make up for it
http://www.prrho.com/rolling-stock_img-53.htm

 

[Boris]

The first color/lettering scheme, (Athearn Boxcar), represents the Shadow Keystone scheme of the 1950s, while the second scheme, (MTH Refrigerator) represents a pre ww2 "Circle Keystone" scheme. Not even considering fading due to light and weather exposure, the pre ww2 paint was different from later paint. Secondly, on the railroad, nothing is exact or the same.

 

[Orange Irish]

Turns out I was fooled by the "BLT" date on the Athearn. It shows 1925 but the X29B was a rebuilt done later on, and I guess that's why it has a 1950s paint scheme (or it's just a poor stand-in version). It's not a huge deal for me, but as famous as the PRR X29s were, I'm surprised their isn't a better or bigger selection out there.

I just want to find a fairly accurate 1930s version to roll behind a PRR M1a. If anyone knows I'll be grateful for the info.

 

[tootnkumin]

I don't know if you noticed but one of those rrpicturesarchives pics was taken in 2011, so yes, they've been around a very long time (must be something of a record surely). The difficulty you're going to have is in getting a colored photo at all from the 30's or before, most if they exist would be black&white (or faded grey by now).

 

[tootnkumin]

Try this site, PRR historical and technical society.
http://www.prrths.com/

 

[GrampysTrains]

This is one of a three pack of Walther's Goldline X29's. DJ.

 

[Boris]

Turns out I was fooled by the "BLT" date on the Athearn. It shows 1925 but the X29B was a rebuilt done later on, and I guess that's why it has a 1950s paint scheme (or it's just a poor stand-in version). It's not a huge deal for me, but as famous as the PRR X29s were, I'm surprised their isn't a better or bigger selection out there.

I just want to find a fairly accurate 1930s version to roll behind a PRR M1a. If anyone knows I'll be grateful for the info.

Try Red Caboose. They make a nice x29. Walthers also makes a decent model. Some of the Red Caboose models come with "stem winder" hand brakes, and Type K air brakes.

I believe the Athearn is probably oversized for the x29, but I am not familiar with Athearn's model.

Note: Pretty much all of the x29s received the Shadow Keystone paint during the late '40s and early '50s including the passenger service versions. Since M1as continued in service through 1957, the Shadow Keystone would be OK. x29s in passenger service and company service outlasted the general service fleet, remaining into the PC and even CR eras.

 

[PaulB]

Not even considering fading due to light and weather exposure, the pre ww2 paint was different from later paint. Secondly, on the railroad, nothing is exact or the same.

That is very true. A friend of mine found that out when restoring cars at a museum. He had a chance to look at prototype paint as he stripped the paint layers on different cars. What he found was that the shade of paint used by the same shop changed over time. This didn't help resolve the argument over the correct shade, but showed there is some latitude in the paint used.

 

[Cjcrescent]

Paul;
That was often due to the shades changing at the manufacturer between batches. Its the same "problem" seen today in our modeling paints. The shades change between the batches. I have 2 Floquil SRR freight car reds. One is definitely darker than the other.

 

[spookyac47]

Turns out I was fooled by the "BLT" date on the Athearn. It shows 1925 but the X29B was a rebuilt done later on, and I guess that's why it has a 1950s paint scheme (or it's just a poor stand-in version). It's not a huge deal for me, but as famous as the PRR X29s were, I'm surprised their isn't a better or bigger selection out there.

I just want to find a fairly accurate 1930s version to roll behind a PRR M1a. If anyone knows I'll be grateful for the info.

The best choice for the X-29 boxcar for the Pennsylvania Railroad is those produced by Red Caboose. A while back, Red Caboose transitioned their production to Intermountain Railroad Company
http://intermountain-railway.com/

This is what might be referred to as a 1934 build with dreadnaught ends, Superior doors, type AB brakes with brake gear on the upper corner of the end. The paint scheme is one of the Circle Keystone schemes

These are generally the cars that others try to compare to.
Since the transition, releases of the original X-29 (or X29 in Pennsy lingo, no dash) have been delayed.
The current release is now scheduled for December 2012, original release was supposed to be August 2012.
http://intermountain-railway.com/newshocomingsoon.html
There are two versions, the original builds, 1928, with "K" type brakes and brakestaff with brakewheel above the roof. The ends are flat plate. The next build, 1934, have "AB" brakes, brake gear and wheel on the end of the car and dreadnaught (rippled) ends. There were many paint schemes as the years went by.
Good information about the X29 and all things PRR can be found at Jerry Britton's Keystone Crossings website.
http://kc.pennsyrr.com/docs/index.php
http://kc.pennsyrr.com/freightops/54_fleet/index.php
http://kc.pennsyrr.com/freightops/schemes.php

The Athearn and MTH cars do not resemble the original X29, they may, in some small way, resemble the rebuilds of the X29 to X29B cars. These were original X29 cars that had their bodies replaced with newer bodies on the old underframe.

The Red Caboose versions sometimes appear on our favorite online auction site . . . as well as the Sunshine resin kits for the X29B.

Many years ago, Train Miniature produced the X29, a reasonablly acceptable replica of the prototype for that era of model railroading. Walthers still produces the same car under their name.
http://www.walthers.com/exec/productinfo/910-1704
This is the 1928 build version (they started building them in 1928 and continued for additional years)
This one has the flat plate ends and the "K" style brake system with the brakestaff and brake wheel above the roof as well as Creco doors. This is one of the Shadow Keystone schemes.

Don
Lower Arizona

 

[Orange Irish]

Thanks for all the replies.

Spooky, thanks for that link. I had checked Red Caboose before (on IM's site) but only found a batch of X-29s that ironically did not include PRR. I guess they only show on the link you posted. In that last few days I found a 1930s era PRR boxcar in the form of the X-31, a kit model by Bowser with a "BLT" date of 1934. Here's an example...

http://www.modeltrainstuff.com/Bowser-HO-X-31-Box-Car-PRR-p/bow-56824.htm

How does the Bowser X-31 compare to the accuracy and quality of the IM X-29? Is the IM version of the X-29 that much better to justify the price?

 

[Boris]

Thanks for all the replies.

How does the Bowser X-31 compare to the accuracy and quality of the IM X-29? Is the IM version of the X-29 that much better to justify the price?

Bowser manufactures some very accurate PRR prototypes, many of which will be appropriate for your era. While the detail may not be as precise as some other products, they are true PRR models, including Flat cars, hoppers, stock cars and box cars, as well as three classes of Cabin Car.

http://www.bowser-trains.com/

 

[Orange Irish]

To my untrained eye they looked fairly close to old photos. I might have to add my own metal wheels but I have plenty of those. I think I might order some boxcars and a few gondolas. It should be fun putting them together.

 

[spookyac47]

Bowser manufactures some very accurate PRR prototypes, many of which will be appropriate for your era. While the detail may not be as precise as some other products, they are true PRR models, including Flat cars, hoppers, stock cars and box cars, as well as three classes of Cabin Car.

http://www.bowser-trains.com/

As mentioned, many of Bowsers car kits and RTR cars are derived from Pennsylvania Railroad prototypes.
The main difference between the Red Caboose X-29 and Bowser's X-31 cab be demonstrated in the two photos I posted. How detailed do you want your cars to be.
The Bowser (as well as the Walthers X-29) cars used cast on grab irons and stirrup steps at the corners. They are thicker . . . and a bit more durable during handling . . . especially is one is picking up the cars frequently.
The Red Caboose X-29 has separately applied grab irons and corner stirrup steps . . . and they are thinner . . . and a bit more delicate.
The running board on the roof may not be as detailed and will usually be a bit thicker on the Walthers and Bowser cars when compared to the Red Caboose cars.
Yes, a few other railroads used the X-29 design that PRR came up with.
Bowser has the X-31, X-32 and X-33 boxcars with a choice of 2 doors or 4 doors - again PRR designs.
http://www.bowser-trains.com/hocars/hocars.htm

Don
Lower Arizona
PRRT&HS 7555

 

[Boris]

As mentioned, many of Bowsers car kits and RTR cars are derived from Pennsylvania Railroad prototypes...........

The Bowser (as well as the Walthers X-29) cars used cast on grab irons and stirrup steps at the corners. They are thicker . . . and a bit more durable during handling . . . especially is one is picking up the cars frequently.
The Red Caboose X-29 has separately applied grab irons and corner stirrup steps . . . and they are thinner . . . and a bit more delicate.
The running board on the roof may not be as detailed and will usually be a bit thicker on the Walthers and Bowser cars when compared to the Red Caboose cars............

Bowser has the X-31, X-32 and X-33 boxcars with a choice of 2 doors or 4 doors - again PRR designs.
http://www.bowser-trains.com/hocars/hocars.htm

Don
Lower Arizona
PRRT&HS 7555

Don:

The only problem with products offering separately applied grab irons and corner stirrup steps is that they frequently end up along the ROW, and inside the storage box.

Joe

 

[tootnkumin]

Rule 1 for seperately applied grabs etc or even (especially) those that are manufacturer fitted. Check everything and apply a spot of CCA liquid glue at the base.