Laying Track on Foam

[Challenger]

Don't think that is crazy at all! Very smart!

Many times we see model railroads thrown in the dumpster due to not being able to be moved easily if they have too.

Thanks!

 

[Challenger]

They will have to cut mine out of the room after I've left this world. It is all screwed and glued. It is also screwed to the wall studs where it was possible. It is rock-solid and there is absolutely no movement.

View attachment 269670

1/2" plywood is fine for benchtop use. The framing members size is sort of a 'depends'. I used 1x4 because I wanted the rigidity and strength for climbing on top of the table during construction and track laying. Most are spaced on 24" centers except where an access opening was needed and then the spacing was a little wider in that section.

If you don't need the rigidity or strength for climbing, then I think 1x3 is fine. Seems a little rickety to me, and the cost is nearly the same for 1x4, but it will work. If you weigh more than about 200-225 I woudn't trust 1x3 for climbing.

Since the layout will be 6' wide and I will have a minimum on all 4 sides of 2' between the benchwork and the walls, I should be able to reach everything with no problem (using a small stool if necessary). I'm under 200, and don't foresee a need to stand on the layout. Still ... it probably does make sense to frame it with 1x4s. Thanks!

 

[NVSrr1500]

To finish my reply to NVSrr1500 --- I understand that the quality of the ply and the proper use of bracing are also going to affect whether the layout is rigid, square and stable. Do you (or others on this forum) think that 1/2 ply and 1x3 joists every 2' on an HO layout will be adequate? Thanks.

I built my last layout with 3/4 ply on 2x4 sections. only had a 2x4 frame and 2 1x4 cross members. designed to be moved in sections, each finished only weighted about 25 pounds. I would recommend simple handle on the inside to make that even easier.

half inch is fine. You can use the cheap c/d grade ply. It is acceptable. just has a few not holes. most of the grade is how it looks. Nothing for us since we cover it. I would recommend 16 inch on center cross members.

Building your layout in sections is a good idea. Screwing it to the wall makes it rigid. just make sure the screws are easy access and easily found. And known about. makes it easier to sell once you're gone.

 

[NVSrr1500]

Thanks - I may end up taking your advice and go with 16". My wife and I have talked about downsizing and finding a place where the bedroom is on the first floor and I don't have 2 acres to mow. In other words, talking about moving at some point. Neither of us wants to but it could happen. I haven't shared the following aspect of my plan on this forum because I know that other model railroaders will think I'm crazy. And they would be right to think that. What I'm thinking is this - build this 6' x 16' layout in 8 separate sections and attach the 8 sections with dry wall screws. Each section would be 3' x 4' and have its own top. Why? Two reasons: (1) I can separate the eight sections, remove the legs, carry everything by myself and fit it in the back of our Subaru Outback. That's the theory, anyway. A lot of work I suppose and more than 1 trip in the Subaru; and (2) if we do move, this gives me some flexibility (maybe I'll only have room for a 6x12 layout). If I go, the benchwork goes with me. Not sure if they make coffins that big, but I'll deal with that later.

building to move is a good plan

 

[Challenger]

I built my last layout with 3/4 ply on 2x4 sections. only had a 2x4 frame and 2 1x4 cross members. designed to be moved in sections, each finished only weighted about 25 pounds. I would recommend simple handle on the inside to make that even easier.

half inch is fine. You can use the cheap c/d grade ply. It is acceptable. just has a few not holes. most of the grade is how it looks. Nothing for us since we cover it. I would recommend 16 inch on center cross members.

Building your layout in sections is a good idea. Screwing it to the wall makes it rigid. just make sure the screws are easy access and easily found. And known about. makes it easier to sell once you're gone.

Good tips. All of them. I was originally thinking cross members every 24" but based on the recommendations of you and others, I'l go with 16". Also, I was wondering about the grade of ply so that is helpful (and makes sense) as well. Thanks.

 

[DeaconKC]

Okay, so much good advice here. Going back to your original idea of laminating foam board, if you do go to glue it down make sure you peel the protective sheets off of both sides of the foam! Also, if you would go back to the foam on ply idea, you could use latex caulk/adhesive thinly spread out to glue the track down directly to the foam. Make sure to use latex and not silicone, as the silicone will not take paint.

 

[Challenger]

Okay, so much good advice here. Going back to your original idea of laminating foam board, if you do go to glue it down make sure you peel the protective sheets off of both sides of the foam! Also, if you would go back to the foam on ply idea, you could use latex caulk/adhesive thinly spread out to glue the track down directly to the foam. Make sure to use latex and not silicone, as the silicone will not take paint.

I agree - so much good advice here. Including yours. For my base, I am going with 1 1/2" foam on 11/32 ply. Some of the track will be placed directly on foam. Other track (certain elevated track) may not be placed directly on foam. Different roadbed materials will call for different adhesives, and I will first test small sections of track. I am thinking that I may not glue the foam to the ply. Call me crazy. I may attempt to secure the foam to the benchwork with a strong "duct tape like" tape that I have. I don't think it's technically duct tape but it is wider than any duct tape I've seen and strongly adhesive. In addition, the hardboard fascia will be slightly higher than the foam and I plan to cut the foam so that it is tight against the fascia. I want to be able to remove the foam easily if I move the layout. If the foam is not glued down, I can unscrew the fascia and use a utility knife to cut the tape. Will the tape and fascia be sufficient over time to ensure a solid base, we'll find out. As we all know, like all plans in life, model railroad plans are subject to change based on experience. Thanks for your comments.

 

[Iron Horseman]

Someday, me or someone else is going to have to dismantle and remove this layout. I didn't want whoever that is to have to deal with large sheets of 3/4" plywood and 2x4s.

Wait. What? You are planning on using 2x4s and large sheets of stuff (plywood foam or whatever)?

Sorry if I am miss understanding, but usually the idea is to have the plywood only where it is needed to support the track. Not everywhere. Between is filled in with foam.
Here is the benchwork and roadbed for my office layout. 12'x12' it is 3/4" plywood roadbed but the heaviest dimensional are the 1x8 edges for "looks". Simple L-girder construction. 2x2 legs.
The whole thing weighs less than 50 lbs.

And the other thing I understood is that you are planning on using spikes and pre-drilling? When I am going to use spikes I purposely do not use a plywood base because it is too hard to drive them in. I cannot imagine pre-drilling that many holes. What size a bit do you need to use a #76?

 

[strobelight]

what fire-retardent materials are available to replace foam for carving valleys and rivers or texturizing the landscape? I too was considering track on foam but now having 2nd thoughts.

 

[b&l railway]

I used 1/4" lauan plywood on top of my bench. It's soft and you can easily push thumb tacks into it. No drilling.

The 4x8 bench is made up of four 2'x4' frame modules made from 1"x3"s. I bolted them together with 5/16 bolts.
The 2'x4' modules makes it easy to disassemble and the ability to change the configuration to accommodate different track plans and room sizes.

It may seem the 1"x3"s wouldn't be strong enough so bolted 1"x8" facia boards that adds strength and ties the modules into one solid unit but still easy to disassemble.

 

[Challenger]

Wait. What? You are planning on using 2x4s and large sheets of stuff (plywood foam or whatever)?

Sorry if I am miss understanding, but usually the idea is to have the plywood only where it is needed to support the track. Not everywhere. Between is filled in with foam.
Here is the benchwork and roadbed for my office layout. 12'x12' it is 3/4" plywood roadbed but the heaviest dimensional are the 1x8 edges for "looks". Simple L-girder construction. 2x2 legs.
The whole thing weighs less than 50 lbs.
View attachment 271877


And the other thing I understood is that you are planning on using spikes and pre-drilling? When I am going to use spikes I purposely do not use a plywood base because it is too hard to drive them in. I cannot imagine pre-drilling that many holes. What size a bit do you need to use a #76?

Wait. What? You are planning on using 2x4s and large sheets of stuff (plywood foam or whatever)?

Sorry if I am miss understanding, but usually the idea is to have the plywood only where it is needed to support the track. Not everywhere. Between is filled in with foam.
Here is the benchwork and roadbed for my office layout. 12'x12' it is 3/4" plywood roadbed but the heaviest dimensional are the 1x8 edges for "looks". Simple L-girder construction. 2x2 legs.
The whole thing weighs less than 50 lbs.
View attachment 271877


And the other thing I understood is that you are planning on using spikes and pre-drilling? When I am going to use spikes I purposely do not use a plywood base because it is too hard to drive them in. I cannot imagine pre-drilling that many holes. What size a bit do you need to use a #76?

Thanks for your input. The photo of the benchwork and roadbed for your office layout is really helpful. Your carpentry skills far surpass mine. With regard to benchwork, I was planning to build a simple grid table, rather than L-girder. Either way, you're right - it makes sense to have the plywood only where it is needed to support the track (not everywhere) and between filled in with foam. Also, now that I've had a chance to think this through more carefully, thanks to comments by you and others, it doesn't make sense to spike track directly to plywood. Your comments were really helpful. I probably should have been able to figure a lot of this out on my own. But sometimes it helps to have somebody say - What the heck are you thinking? Thanks!

 

[Challenger]

I used 1/4" lauan plywood on top of my bench. It's soft and you can easily push thumb tacks into it. No drilling.

The 4x8 bench is made up of four 2'x4' frame modules made from 1"x3"s. I bolted them together with 5/16 bolts.
The 2'x4' modules makes it easy to disassemble and the ability to change the configuration to accommodate different track plans and room sizes.

It may seem the 1"x3"s wouldn't be strong enough so bolted 1"x8" facia boards that adds strength and ties the modules into one solid unit but still easy to disassemble.

Thanks for you input. At one point, I was thinking I would connect the modules with drywall screws, but bolting them together makes much more sense. Using 1x8 facia boards to add strength and tie the modules together into one solid unit sounds like a smart way to go. Thanks!

 

[b&l railway]

Thanks for you input. At one point, I was thinking I would connect the modules with drywall screws, but bolting them together makes much more sense.

If you use this approach don't use carriage bolts. Although they look a little nicer than a bolt head, after repeated use they can strip out the wood and just spin when trying to remove them.
Very frustrating for someone who doesn't know how to deal with a spinning carriage bolt.

 

[b&l railway]

Using 1x8 facia boards to add strength and tie the modules together into one solid unit sounds like a smart way to go.

BTW, i used 1x8s so there would be a wall around the track in case the train derails.

However, if you center the bolt holes properly you can rotate the facia for full access to the track.

 

[Challenger]

BTW, i used 1x8s so there would be a wall around the track in case the train derails.
View attachment 272020
However, if you center the bolt holes properly you can rotate the facia for full access to the track. View attachment 272021

Thanks for the tip regarding carriage bolts. I don't know how to deal with a spinning top ... let alone a spinning carriage bolt. Also - on an earlier layout, I learned (the hard way, of course) to make the fascia tall enough to prevent a locomotive from hitting the floor.

 

[RhB Michael]

Your coal tipple needs to be at the entrance to the track. Otherwise, how are the cars in front of the last car going to be filled?

 

[Challenger]

Agreed.

Your coal tipple needs to be at the entrance to the track. Otherwise, how are the cars in front of the last car going to be filled?

So ... that's why the cars in front of the last car never have any coal? Who knew? Glad you enjoyed the video! Thanks!

 

[Challenger]

Oh ... now I get it. You were referring to the tipple on b&l railway's layout. Sorry ... it doesn't take much to confuse me.

 

[b&l railway]

Oh ... now I get it. You were referring to the tipple on b&l railway's layout. Sorry ... it doesn't take much to confuse me.

Yes. Its in the wrong place. My grandson and i change the layout fairly frequently but the current layout doesn't Really support the tipper.
I only shared the pic to show how the 1x8 facia can be rotated down for full access to the track.

 

[Challenger]

Yes. Its in the wrong place. My grandson and i change the layout fairly frequently but the current layout doesn't Really support the tipper.
I only shared the pic to show how the 1x8 facia can be rotated down for full access to the track.

No worries. I didn't even notice there was a tipple on your layout until it was pointed out. I was focused on the 1x8 facia. I've watched countless model rr photos and videos on YouTube and have never come across a layout where the facia could be rotated down for full access to the track. Kudos to you and your grandson. Very cool (and creative)!