Help with new layout in basement for HO scale

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N

NUTNDUN

Member
I would love some help from the more experienced modelers with a layout for our basement. I bought a license for anyrail and have gotten a start on it but I feel that it could be designed better for a more real to life experience. I don't have any particular railroad I want to model nor a time frame. I would more then likely stick with the 70's and newer diesel engines. However I do like steam as well and would like to have a steam passenger train at some point.

I currently have two engines. Both are BLI AC6000. One is a UP and the other is a CSX. I also currently have the NCE power cab and will be getting the Procab 5 amp set to go with it. I do plan on eventually hooking the computer up to the layout and also motorizing all the turnouts as the budget would allow.

The room I have in the basement is 12' x 37'. The basement steps come down towards the middle right of the basement but they are open underneath and would probably make a good place to put the staging / yard area. I would like to have a maintenance area with a turntable also. I know I will like to run longer trains and also to have a nice grade along one of the mainlines to be able to put the engines to the test.

Would love if anyone would mind taking the time to help me with a layout or offer suggestions on what could be improved or is completely wrong. I am going to attach two layout ideas that I had started on so far.
 
You need to come up with a list of your "givens and druthers" - what do you want to do and why do you want to do it - before sketching out anything (although some people do prefer to just put down tracks and let the design flow as they build). Great space you have there BTW.
 
Welcome to the forum! 12'x37' is a good sized space for a layout. I agree with Beachbum, to a greater extent in that before you start a design, it helps to have an idea of what you're trying to achieve. Is this your first layout? The reason I ask is, if it is, starting with such a large blank slate can be rather intimidating. Having said that however, not having to cramm the whole UP or CSX into a 4'x8' layout can be liberating.

My first question in terms of helping you is: what are you trying to model? You mention having a grade, and having relatively modern equipment. Looking at your plan, it seems like at least one of them involves relatively small radius curves, if you intend to run longer modern equipment(autoracks, etc). From what I can tell, you've got plenty of space for operators to wander around the layout. On the other hand, I don't think you'd have a problem in terms of reaching, if you made at least some portion of the layout say 30-36" wide. It will give you a little more modeling space, and shoudn't seriously impact the aisle space.

Another leasoned learned over time, that many people may mention is that using wider radius curves will enhance reliability, and make the layout more scenically realistic.

Getting back to what you're trying to model, I see you've identified a potential location of a yard, in the room. Could be a good place to start, but what else do you want, besides a yard, and a grade? Some sort of engine servicing facilities? A shop, in addition to the servicing facilities? My next question would be, what is the purpose of the yard? To store equipment? Most working yards on prototype railroads don't really store equipment, except when the economy takes a down turn. Otherwise a yard blocks, or classifies cars for either local or distant locaitons? Are you looking to represent on your layout an area with a lot of local industry, or somewhere more rural? Depending on that among other things, will help you and us, figure out possible things to include on your layout/in your design?
 


And philosophically, what do you want your model railroading experience to be? If you build a mainline, you basically have long trains running fast and not making many stops, and you're a railfan. If you concentrate on running locals, then you're a conductor/brakeman/engineer. If the emphasis is on realistic car orders, then maybe you're the freight agent and/or yardmaster, as well. And (sigh) do you expect to run this railroad solo, or do you want to have a crew come in and take a variety of jobs? These things ought to affect the design, right from the start.

It is entirely true that yards are not for storing trains. You should have staging for that; if your cars are stopped in the yard, they aren't earning anything. Cars should come in and go out again promptly. Don't let yourself delay them so long that you have to pay compensation!
 
NUTNDUN said:
I currently have two engines. Both are BLI AC6000. One is a UP and the other is a CSX.
Click to expand...

About the only places that UP and CSX overlap are in Chicago, St. Louis, Memphis, and New Orleans. UP is mainly west of the Mississippi River, and CSX is east of it.

If you don't want to model one of those four cities, you might sell off one of your locos and use the money for a more appropriate one.


UP map...
http://www.up.com/cs/groups/public/documents/digitalmedia/omhq17a129812003479.gif

CSX map...
http://ottawaindustrialpark.com/images/csx-map.gif

Steve S
 
One thing I would say for a first time builder is dont be in a hurry to finalise your plan. Take the time to see other peaples layouts, join a club and engage in some operating sessions on different layouts and you will get a far better idea of what is good, bad and preferable to yourself. See if you can get hold of this book to read ; Track Planning for Realistic Operation by john armstrong.- it is excellant.
I would suggest that for passenger operations a continious running mainline with at least two stations is the start point. and for freight operations you want to think about pairs of industries such as a coal mine and a steel mill to give a source and a destination for your goods. You can also use a hidden staging yard instead of an industry which is some distance away.
Im a fairly new modeler myself Ive built one layout and am planning a bigger and better one at the moment, so can understand the stage you are at.
 
I currently have a typical oval on a 6' x 12' table which is at least helping prolong the urge to build a bigger layout right away. I have a siding to at least be able to switch cars up so that helps occupy the time. I have the week off between Christmas and New Years in which I would love to at least start on some of it.

I was thinking about doing something with a paper mill and a steel mill since we have both of those fairly close here in PA. I do like some of the end to end layouts with the different industries and I also like the mainlines for being able to run longer trains. Would like to be able to do both if I can pull it off. If I end up modeling any specific railroad it will be PRR, NS, CSX and Conrail because that is what is local.

Even though UP and BNSF wouldn't operate where I would model I would still want to have engines in both of their colors and possibly others as time goes on.
 
I forgot to add that as for operators it is more than likely only going to be me, possibly my dad on occasion and my 7 year old daughter as she gains more interest.

I do plan on going to the local club to check their layout out and see how things operate. I originally thought I would want a continuous loop for a mainline but might be leaning more towards an end to end with classification yards at each end possibly. I understand about the staging area and I know I say this now and would more than likely change but I wouldn't have enough rolling stock to consider having a staging yard hidden away.
 
I will take back what I said about the whole staging area. I misunderstood what the actual purpose of it was. I was thinking it was more of a storage area which I guess depending how it is used it could be. After doing some more reading I realize that staging is more of a way to extend the layout to a whole other location without using any layout space. Going to do a lot more reading and understanding everything. I think on the couple of layout ideas that I have done so far I was trying to cram too much in right away.

All credit to the designer of this layout as I was surfing his site and I believe he is a member here but I love this layout even though it is for N scale and wouldn't work in the dimensions that I have: http://www.layoutvision.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderfiles/cs_trackplan_2_4.pdf
 
NUTNDUN said:
I currently have a typical oval on a 6' x 12' table which is at least helping prolong the urge to build a bigger layout right away. I have a siding to at least be able to switch cars up so that helps occupy the time. I have the week off between Christmas and New Years in which I would love to at least start on some of it.

I was thinking about doing something with a paper mill and a steel mill since we have both of those fairly close here in PA. I do like some of the end to end layouts with the different industries and I also like the mainlines for being able to run longer trains. Would like to be able to do both if I can pull it off. If I end up modeling any specific railroad it will be PRR, NS, CSX and Conrail because that is what is local.

Even though UP and BNSF wouldn't operate where I would model I would still want to have engines in both of their colors and possibly others as time goes on.
Click to expand...
it sounds like we are both at the same stage then it will be interesting to see what you eventually build
 


Keep in mind, staging doesnt have to be big, or take up lots of room either.
It could be as simple as 2 tracks , to get a train in and to get a train out, granted you have a train already made up, to simulate a new train arriving from somewhere else!
 
I thought I had a good plan in my head that would have integrated a staging area with a mainline and a branch line with about 4 industries, a classification yard and also a maintenance area but once I started trying to lay it out in anyrail it is amazing how quickly the room disappears.
 
Disapears? LOL Good lord you have no worries. You got 37 feet on that back wall. You should have plently of room for what you want, and more.

What I would do, and I also model modern era 1998-Present. You could have like 3 large industries. Coal Mine, Power Plant/Rotary Dumper, Steel Mill.

And then also add some small industries that serve like 6-8 cars. Lumber Yard, Saw Mill, Oil Tanks, Ethanol Plant, Grain Silos.

So the area you drew. The stairs come down to the basement? Can the tracks run around the outside, and the you operate from the middle? Or will you have turn-around blobs at each end?

Don't go less than 30" radius curves.
 
The tracks can run all around the perimeter. There is about 2' of width to pass through under the steps on the back wall. There is also a doorway to the back half of the basement on the back wall 12' from the left side which I will make a removable piece. It isn't too often that we go back on that side of the basement. Could also do some sort of peninsula on the left side as well if it would help.

I was thinking of trying to do some sort of outbound and incoming yard with possibly doing some sort of staging. Would like to be able to pull off two mainlines along with the branch lines but I think it might be too much. Might have to stick with one mainline.

I have been staring at layout pictures and also satellite shots of local yards and industries but for some reason when it comes to putting stuff down in anyrail I just draw a blank like I wasn't even looking at anything. Probably time to take a break from it LOL.

Thanks for all of the feedback so far from everyone.
 
Motley said:
Disapears? LOL Good lord you have no worries. You got 37 feet on that back wall. You should have plently of room for what you want, and more.

What I would do, and I also model modern era 1998-Present. You could have like 3 large industries. Coal Mine, Power Plant/Rotary Dumper, Steel Mill.

And then also add some small industries that serve like 6-8 cars. Lumber Yard, Saw Mill, Oil Tanks, Ethanol Plant, Grain Silos.

So the area you drew. The stairs come down to the basement? Can the tracks run around the outside, and the you operate from the middle? Or will you have turn-around blobs at each end?

Don't go less than 30" radius curves.
Click to expand...

I miss that fellow stein so bad right now....
 
NUTNDUN said:
The tracks can run all around the perimeter. There is about 2' of width to pass through under the steps on the back wall. There is also a doorway to the back half of the basement on the back wall 12' from the left side which I will make a removable piece. It isn't too often that we go back on that side of the basement. Could also do some sort of peninsula on the left side as well if it would help.

I was thinking of trying to do some sort of outbound and incoming yard with possibly doing some sort of staging. Would like to be able to pull off two mainlines along with the branch lines but I think it might be too much. Might have to stick with one mainline.

I have been staring at layout pictures and also satellite shots of local yards and industries but for some reason when it comes to putting stuff down in anyrail I just draw a blank like I wasn't even looking at anything. Probably time to take a break from it LOL.

Thanks for all of the feedback so far from everyone.
Click to expand...

Ya definatley go for the two mainlines. Nothing like seeing two trains pass each other going opposite directions.
 
I am thinking the area under the steps would be a good spot to put the staging. Was also thinking about putting the yard and the maintenance area on the right hand side. Run the mainlines all the way around to the staging area under the steps. Have a end to end branch line feeding the different industries around the layout.

The other option I was thinking about would be to put the yard on the left back side, still keeping the staging area under the steps with the maintenance area just to the left of the steps. Was thinking it might be better to have the yard area on the left side of the basement.
 
You can do alot with the space you have! The open space down on the south side of your room, is this open to the rest of the basement?

If it was open to the rest of the basement, would you be willing to run across this to make one huge complete loop??

You could also have 360 turn back loops or (blobs) if the space is open and didnt want to run across the south of room.

A peninsula is a great idea for a major industry or even a good sized yard depending on the size of the peninsula, you could have a wye coming off the peninsula so you can easily turn locos and or the direction of which you would like to run.

Are you thinking of building a shelf to go around the perimeter of say 24-30 inches wide? i wouldnt go any wider unless you have access hatches for reach issues.

Also, i know this was stated before, but absolutely in your corners have nice radius curves. Nothing less then 30 inches is very doable with the space you have. It looks so much better, it doesnt look (toy-like) when your running modern equipment.
 
Last edited by a moderator:


joed2323 said:
You can do alot with the space you have! The open space down on the south side of your room, is this open to the rest of the basement?

If it was open to the rest of the basement, would you be willing to run across this to make one huge complete loop??

You could also have 360 turn back loops or (blobs) if the space is open and didnt want to run across the south of room.

A peninsula is a great idea for a major industry or even a good sized yard depending on the size of the peninsula, you could have a wye coming off the peninsula so you can easily turn locos and or the direction of which you would like to run.

Are you thinking of building a shelf to go around the perimeter of say 24-30 inches wide? i wouldnt go any wider unless you have access hatches for reach issues.
Click to expand...


The 12' x 37' half of the basement is closed off from the other half of the basement other than a regular doorway 12' from the left side on the south wall. I was thinking 2' to 3' throughout most of it around the perimeter. I will have to narrow it down to only the two mainlines where the steps come down at the north wall.

I have been working on a yard layout and I am actually headed in the right direction I believe. I will post up a pic of the layout so far as well as some better markings as to the layout of the basement here in a little while.
 
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