Can you convert Kusan 2-rail O gauge models to 3-rail operation?

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T

The Railroading Phoenix

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Pretty much what the title says. There's a postwar Kusan "Atomic Train", Catalogue number KF-110, that I'm looking at buying, but I do 3-rail O gauge, and this set is 2-rail. Is there any way to convert this set to 3-rail operation, and if so, what would I need to do? You can read about the set here if you're curious, it's really neat https://www.robertstrains.com/Atomic.htm
 
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Yes, you can convert a Kusan 2‑rail O gauge model to 3‑rail — but it’s not a simple or inexpensive swap.
It is absolutely doable, but it requires mechanical, electrical, and pickup modifications because Kusan was never designed for Lionel-style center‑rail AC operation.

Here’s what you’d need to do if you wanted that Kusan KF‑110 “Atomic Train” to run on your 3‑rail layout:

Add center‑rail pickup rollers
Kusan 2‑rail trucks have no provision for rollers.
You must either: replace the trucks with 3‑rail trucks that accept rollers, or fabricate a roller mount that attaches to the existing truck frame. Most people choose replacement trucks because it’s cleaner and more reliable.

Insulate one side of the wheels
2‑rail wheels are insulated on one side only.
3‑rail wheels are not insulated because both outer rails are common ground.

You must: remove the wheel insulation, or replace the wheelsets entirely with 3‑rail wheelsets.

Convert the motor for AC operation
Kusan used DC motors in many of their postwar models.

To run on Lionel-style AC track power, you need: a bridge rectifier (to convert AC → DC), OR a full modern electronic board (E-unit, reverse board, etc.), OR replace the motor with a universal AC motor. A small rectifier is cheap and reliable.

Rewire the locomotive
You’ll need to: route center-rail power to the rectifier, route outer-rail ground to the motor frame, isolate any lighting circuits, ensure no part of the frame shorts across the rails. It’s not hard, but it’s meticulous.

Check coupler height and truck swing
Kusan’s geometry is slightly different from Lionel’s.
If you swap trucks, you may need: shims, washers, or minor frame trimming.
 
Damn, that's unfortunate, I take it I can't just swap the original Kusan trucks and motor unit for Lionel ones? The coupler geometry doesn't bug me too much, I wasn't planning on running it with anything other than what it came with unless I wanted to add some extra cars, and I can cross that bridge if/when I get there
 


Also, genuine question, why was this moved from locomotives and rolling stock to tinplate and hi-rail? Like, I'm genuinely confused, the set in question is neither tinplate nor hi-rail, therefore this is objectively the wrong category. Is there any way it can be moved either back to locomotives and rolling stock or to O scale? Either one would be much more appropriate than where it is now, please and thanks
 
The Railroading Phoenix said:
Also, genuine question, why was this moved from locomotives and rolling stock to tinplate and hi-rail? Like, I'm genuinely confused, the set in question is neither tinplate nor hi-rail, therefore this is objectively the wrong category. Is there any way it can be moved either back to locomotives and rolling stock or to O scale? Either one would be much more appropriate than where it is now, please and thanks
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Lionel 3 rail is Hi-rail. This thread is in the forum it belongs.
 
Hi‑rail is one of those terms that gets used differently depending on the group. Some people use it to mean realistic 3‑rail modeling, others use it to mean anything that runs on Lionel‑style 3‑rail track. Some even use it to describe O‑27 traditional layouts.

On this forum, “hi‑rail” is basically the category for all 3‑rail O‑gauge topics. Since you’re asking about converting a Kusan 2‑rail model to 3‑rail operation, the moderators put it here because the end result is a hi‑rail (3‑rail) locomotive. It’s about the model — just how the forum organizes O‑gauge discussions.

And don't feel bad, i Have had several threads moved. I appreciate how the Moderators keep thing organized.
 
See, I've never heard 3-rail called hi-rail before, that's new to me. I've always known hi-rail/high-rail to be a rubber-tired road vehicle that's had special equipment added so it can be driven on railroad tracks as well. That's why I was so confused, because this set definitely isn't that, and it's definitely not tinplate either
 
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Another idea is to use a Lionel alco motor and frame. If it fits? Then just add Lionel trucks to the other cars. Doing it this way you still have the original trucks and motor.

Work wise it would be easier to convert the three rail track and just insulate the one outside rail. I do not know if the track width is the same between two and three rail.
 
One potential issue with using a Lionel motor unit is that unless I modify the shell to accommodate an E-unit lever or use a more modern electronic E-unit, it'd have to either be forward-only or be like a Marx engine and not have an E-unit lockout
 
The Railroading Phoenix said:
Pretty much what the title says. There's a postwar Kusan "Atomic Train", Catalogue number KF-110, that I'm looking at buying, but I do 3-rail O gauge, and this set is 2-rail. Is there any way to convert this set to 3-rail operation, and if so, what would I need to do? You can read about the set here if you're curious, it's really neat https://www.robertstrains.com/Atomic.htm
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The Kusan locos in your link pic's look to be spitting images of Lionel's postwar Alco FA1 locos. It may be possible just to buy some used Lionel FA1's and do a shell swap. Keep in mind, early postwar Lionel Alco's had cast metal frames, and their later postwar FA1's had stamped sheet metal frames. Judging from your link pic's, I'm guessing your Kusan units maybe have cast metal frames? Don't know for sure, as I am unfamiliar with Kusan products.

The rolling stock should also be able to interchange trucks with Lionel rolling stock. However, you may have to get fairly inventive, depending on any differences in how the trucks are attached to the bodies between the two manufacturers.

The Railroading Phoenix said:
Also, genuine question, why was this moved from locomotives and rolling stock to tinplate and hi-rail? Like, I'm genuinely confused, the set in question is neither tinplate nor hi-rail, therefore this is objectively the wrong category. Is there any way it can be moved either back to locomotives and rolling stock or to O scale? Either one would be much more appropriate than where it is now, please and thanks
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Keep in mind, the moderator(s) are probably doing you a favor by moving your post to a category where you stand a far better chance of getting you inquiry(s) answered. For instance, if they had not moved it, I and others, may not have ever bothered checking where you originally posted.

The Railroading Phoenix said:
See, I've never heard 3-rail called hi-rail before, that's new to me. I've always known hi-rail/high-rail to be a rubber-tired road vehicle that's had special equipment added so it can be driven on railroad tracks as well. That's why I was so confused, because this set definitely isn't that, and it's definitely not tinplate either
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This Kusan set IS actually high rail. The rails in your linked pictures ARE formed tubular rails, just like Lionel. Except there's only 2 rails, instead of 3 rails.

In any case, that atomic set is definitely cool! Now that I have seen the pic's you linked, I'm not so sure I wouldn't mind having a set! 👍
 


Mixed Freight said:
The Kusan locos in your link pic's look to be spitting images of Lionel's postwar Alco FA1 locos. It may be possible just to buy some used Lionel FA1's and do a shell swap. Keep in mind, early postwar Lionel Alco's had cast metal frames, and their later postwar FA1's had stamped sheet metal frames. Judging from your link pic's, I'm guessing your Kusan units maybe have cast metal frames? Don't know for sure, as I am unfamiliar with Kusan products.

The rolling stock should also be able to interchange trucks with Lionel rolling stock. However, you may have to get fairly inventive, depending on any differences in how the trucks are attached to the bodies between the two manufacturers.


Keep in mind, the moderator(s) are probably doing you a favor by moving your post to a category where you stand a far better chance of getting you inquiry(s) answered. For instance, if they had not moved it, I and others, may not have ever bothered checking where you originally posted.


This Kusan set IS actually high rail. The rails in your linked pictures ARE formed tubular rails, just like Lionel. Except there's only 2 rails, instead of 3 rails.

In any case, that atomic set is definitely cool! Now that I have seen the pic's you linked, I'm not so sure I wouldn't mind having a set! 👍
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Looking at images of the Lionel and Kusan frames, I don't think they're even remotely interchangeable without serious modifications, same thing with the motor units. However, I might be able to adapt Lionel FA center rail pickups to the unpowered truck and go from there

I don't think I'm gonna worry about that right now, I'm not entirely sure if I'm even gonna buy this set, and if I do, I don't have any plans to run it with cars other than what it comes with for the time being

Yes, I understand that now, but I didn't at the time

Yeah, I have to wonder if the Kusan track is compatible with the 2-rail tubular track Marx wind-up trains came with

It definitely is, I just have to hope that the gun barrels on the locomotive's turret aren't broken, but I can probably fix that if they are
 
How about this idea for converting to 3-rail......................

K-Line Army Train Set

I believe K-Line may have been the last big user of the old Kusan tooling.
Here's one pic from the ad.............
1791083430934.png

Notice any similarities to the Atomic Train?
 
Mixed Freight said:
How about this idea for converting to 3-rail......................

K-Line Army Train Set

I believe K-Line may have been the last big user of the old Kusan tooling.
Here's one pic from the ad.............
View attachment 274734
Notice any similarities to the Atomic Train?
Click to expand...
Ooooo, interesting idea, however, those K-line FAs start at $90 before shipping on Ebay, which is over double what I'd pay for the entire Kusan set, and that's not worth it to me
 
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