Back with a new plan...feedback requested

[Wheels70]

I got some good feedback from my first set of posts here...and I've spent the past few weeks digesting that, reading, and coming up with a new track plan.

Operationally, three locations are represented. The yard at the bottom is at Geneva, the industrial section above that is Ithaca, and the town above the view block is Naples. My inspiration is the LVRR, but there's only a passing nod to realism here.

I've placed structures and run trains using Xtrkcad, and it all works. Before I spend the time to tweak things I'd like feedback. What do you think could be improved, where do you think I'm likely to run into trouble?

Thanks,
Thomas

 

[IronBeltKen]

(1) I see you have a few spur tracks running underneath the northern half of the layout. And it appears you've allocated enough length of track to keep the grade between 2.5 - 3.0 percent. But how easy will it be for you to reach any cars you have on those covered lower-level spurs?

(2) I can see at least 2 turnouts you could eliminate without sacrificing any operating capability - the ones I highlighted in red in my attached diagram. Regardless of whether or not those turnouts are there, you'll still need to temporarily move any cars you have spotted at Bolle & Sons or MF Walker while shifting the Winery. Remember: the fewer turnouts, the fewer potential derailment spots!

(3) You may have already mentioned this in an earlier post - and if you did I apologize - but will your layout be accessible from all 4 sides? If not, you may have serious reach issues.

 

[Wheels70]

Hi CSX,

(1) Yeah, I'm not so sure about the reach on those hidden sidings. I'm going to try a few experiments to see how well they work, and if they prove troublesome I have a couple alternative ideas in mind. And good guess on the grades, they are 2.4%.

(2) Thanks. I will run a couple switching scenarios and see which of those two passing sidings I want to keep.

(3) I have really, really, long arms . No, I'll have access from all 4 sides.

Thomas

 

[Burlington Bob]

Hi, Thomas. Glad to see your "new and improved" layout. And I really do believe it is a great improvement over earlier designs. I think CSX has a good point about the turnouts. Also glad to see Uncle Bob's Sauces has a spot on the layout!

 

[IronBeltKen]

May I also suggest.....?

...a slight rearrangement of the trackwork between the turntable and the coaling tower (note the blue-highlighted tracks in my diagram). This gives you 2 things:

(1) A longer passing siding; and

(2) a single longer, gentler S-curve instead of two short, abrupt ones.

...just a little more food for thought!

 

[Doughless]

I definitely like your new plan better than the old plans. You're a lot closer to a workable layout. I like CSX's changes also. Working with his plan, some other suggestions:

Naples: I would put coal and water on the track by the turntable, then move the passenger depot to the former coal spot. Then lengthen the freight house's spur since the depot is moved. Edited: You could reinstall turnouts near where CSX removed them. If you two LH turnouts, one near where his blue line ends and the other to the right of the winery turnout, you can then switch the winery cluster w/o having to move cars that are in front of Bolles or Walker.

Geneva: Eliminate the small runaround at the bottom. It doesn't really serve a purpose except to add track and turnouts. Use the space created by the eliminated track to relocate coal, sand, and water there. If not enough room there, move them to the word Geneva. Move the car shop to the two tracks near the turntable and use the former shop tracks as your yard. Consider having a smaller, one track car shop.

Ithaca: Its a mess. Too much track and access issues as CSX mentioned. If you eliminated the hidden spurs, the grade of the layout could be even less since the only place one track would be above another is the far NW corner. Edited: I would eliminate those two industries and condense the passenger structures to their location. I would remove the loading platform and its spur to declutter more. Nothing wrong with just having one industry in that town, since you have passenger service. Think about Ithaca more.

 

[cajon]

I definitely like your new plan better than the old plans. You're a lot closer to a workable layout. I like CSX's changes also. Working with his plan, some other suggestions:

Naples: I would put coal and water on the track by the turntable, then move the passenger depot to the former coal spot. Then lengthen the freight house's spur since the depot is moved. Edited: You could reinstall turnouts near where CSX removed them. If you two LH turnouts, one near where his blue line ends and the other to the right of the winery turnout, you can then switch the winery cluster w/o having to move cars that are in front of Bolles or Walker.

Geneva: Eliminate the small runaround at the bottom. It doesn't really serve a purpose except to add track and turnouts. Use the space created by the eliminated track to relocate coal, sand, and water there. If not enough room there, move them to the word Geneva. Move the car shop to the two tracks near the turntable and use the former shop tracks as your yard. Consider having a smaller, one track car shop.

Ithaca: Its a mess. Too much track and access issues as CSX mentioned. If you eliminated the hidden spurs, the grade of the layout could be even less since the only place one track would be above another is the far NW corner. Edited: I would eliminate those two industries and condense the passenger structures to their location. I would remove the loading platform and its spur to declutter more. Nothing wrong with just having one industry in that town, since you have passenger service. Think about Ithaca more.

Have to agree w/ everything Doughless said. Overall the plan has good potential it's just how each station is cluttered for no good reasons. Would add the engine service facilities should be right on the turntable tracks not the opposite ends of the sidings. Ithaca should have a siding on the main & not on the spur. Instead of having those 2 hidden spurs run them parallel to the backdrop w/ false front buildings or docks w/ building pix on backdrop.

 

[Wheels70]

Okay, a few modifications have been made. First, Naples:

(1) Elevation at Naples is 4.75 instead of 5 inches. I docked the surveyor a week's pay and made him recheck the whole line from Ithaca to Naples.

(2) Per CSX's suggestion, rearranged track by turntable to lengthen passing siding and reduce S-curve. Per Doughless's suggestion, moved the coal/water facilities closer to the turntable and passenger terminal to their old location.

(3) The above changes gave me a couple other ideas. Now, when a train comes in it spots cars at passenger/freight siding on track 1. The rest of the train is still on the main line by the turntable. The loco pulls forward into the spur at AH Wilcox and backs out onto track 2 (the main), picks up the remainder of the train and pulls into track 3 (per standing instructions to "keep main clear at all times except as necessary for switching".) The rest of Naples can then be switched. The main line now continues past Naples (curved track below AH Wilcox).

In Ithaca, I eliminated the hidden spurs (multiple concerns here) and took cajon's suggestion and added a siding. I think I can simplify a bit more here without losing any operational capabilities -- I need to run trains here again.

Geneva...I am not sure what you mean here, Doughless. I'm using the runaround when working the yard, so it does serve a purpose. Can you expand a bit and help me understand?

Thanks to all for the compliments and, as always, for the helpful suggestions.

Thomas

 

[Doughless]

Okay, a few modifications have been made. First, Naples:

(1) Elevation at Naples is 4.75 instead of 5 inches. I docked the surveyor a week's pay and made him recheck the whole line from Ithaca to Naples.

(2) Per CSX's suggestion, rearranged track by turntable to lengthen passing siding and reduce S-curve. Per Doughless's suggestion, moved the coal/water facilities closer to the turntable and passenger terminal to their old location.

(3) The above changes gave me a couple other ideas. Now, when a train comes in it spots cars at passenger/freight siding on track 1. The rest of the train is still on the main line by the turntable. The loco pulls forward into the spur at AH Wilcox and backs out onto track 2 (the main), picks up the remainder of the train and pulls into track 3 (per standing instructions to "keep main clear at all times except as necessary for switching".) The rest of Naples can then be switched. The main line now continues past Naples (curved track below AH Wilcox).

In Ithaca, I eliminated the hidden spurs (multiple concerns here) and took cajon's suggestion and added a siding. I think I can simplify a bit more here without losing any operational capabilities -- I need to run trains here again.

Geneva...I am not sure what you mean here, Doughless. I'm using the runaround when working the yard, so it does serve a purpose. Can you expand a bit and help me understand?

Thanks to all for the compliments and, as always, for the helpful suggestions.

Thomas

Your new ideas have cluttered things up again. Try having one runaround per town. Hardly ever does any town need two.

In Naples, you will not be able to pull the loco up to AH Wilcox to get back to track 2 if there is already a car spotted there.
The track by wilcox should be the main line but used on your layout as an used as an engine escape for the runaround only, not an industry spur.

What I would do is...pull the train onto track 1 with the passenger cars in front. Runaround the train and grab the freight cars at the end of the train and head back down the main to then switch track 3 and the winery. This way, there is no reason to make tracks 2 and 3 a runaround. Move the switches that make 2 and 3 a runaround to the E of the winery in order to be able to switch the winery from track 2. Eliminate what is now the main by the winery and wilcox all together.

Ithaca. You are using the passenger runaround for an industry spur and using the engine escape for an icehouse and platform. You don't have any way to runaround an arrived train if cars are spotted at those industries. If it was my layout, I would eliminate the new runaround, the two new industries, the icehouse and platform, and the loading platform spur. Move the passenger area to where the two new industroies are.

Geneva: I don't see where you need the track 2 and 3 runaround. You can use the turntable as a switch lead to switch the yard, if the yard tracks are the tracks on the left where the shop is. The shop should be on the right.

I think its got the potential to be a fun layout, once you discover that less is more.

 

[cajon]

Thomas
See what you think of this version. Think it addresses most of the comments.