Are oval shaped train layouts automatically boring?

[Snowman]

One of the things about MR that pushed me to look forward to that dream layout is: the ability to run big engines and long freight or passenger cars without them looking way oversized on the curves.
When you can just about see the inside rail from under the passenger car on a curve, it just loses that effect of real trains. Ya want to be able to run longer trains with multiple engines as you age in the hobby. Yeah, some folks may be content with their Poopsy Daisy, point to point, 1867 era, O gauge shelf railroad that runs three feet along their sunroom wall, but I think those are few and far between.

I completely agree. Moreover, I've heard you comment more than once (and I also agree), "a lot of guys just run too fast." You are careful not to offend when you do, so I hope that's appreciated by others.

 

[Guilford Railman]

Does it have to be 4x8 or can you cut the board at all?

View attachment 152413

I like this plan a lot! Might have to build this in the future…

 

[dave1905]

"Boring" is a personal judgement based on your personal goals. If you are happy with a plan then 4x8 can keep you going for years. If it doesn't do what you want then, no, it won't meet your needs and be boring.

Some people want reaaaaaaaalllllly long trains and just want to run. I personally don't get too excited by that. I want the train to DO something. Different things are preferred by different people. The hard part is learning what you want. The second part is trying to fit what you want into the space you have. That is the real rub. If you want 30 car trains through Wyoming and all you have is a 8x10 spare bedroom, you might not ever find a plan that really satisfies you. You might want to find a model railroad club, be part of a modular set up or make friends with somebody who has a 30x40 basement. On the other had if you like switching, you might be satisfied by 2x10 shelf switching layout and an 8x10 room would let you build an "empire".

 

[JeffH]

I like long trains running slowly, more like scale speeds. I agree that most modelers run their trains too fast. I'm guilty of that myself, especially when I'm showing the layout to other people. I don't want them to get bored while I let the train creep along. I'd rather go aloittle fast and get the trains through tunnels and over bridges... and setting turnouts to alternative routes, etc.

But when I'm by myself, I run them probably around 10-15MPH at scale.

 

[Selector]

The hold over days from the racing car hotwheels or whatever they were back in the day, and modern video games with fast paced action of all kinds, driving, flying, killing...it becomes the norm. I never did run my trains quickly, even when I was a kid. Maybe I was more observant that most, but I knew instinctively that locomotives must trail tonnage by design, and that they do so laboriously down the tracks with observers seeing things go by no faster, or much faster, than an automobile passes through terrain. The whizzy-bang action is not my style.

My coal drags, especially going up grades, will go a slow 15 mph, while fast freight, mail, express, and pax run at track speed, 60-79 mph. In scale, of course.

Taken years ago now, on my second layout, this stylized photo shows a Class J from the Norfolk & Western roaring past pop and the kids getting a thrill. Not the best place for dad to take the kids, but they'll never forget this experience.

 

[trailrider]

There is a point to running trains prototypically slowly, especially on a smaller layout. I have one exception to this... The original shovelnose Pioneer Zephyr #9900 often hit 100 mph in certain places. Of course it still looks better running more slowly in HO scale around my folded dogbone in my 14 x 13' 8" room.

 

[Boris]

I like long trains running slowly, more like scale speeds. I agree that most modelers run their trains too fast. I'm guilty of that myself, especially when I'm showing the layout to other people. I don't want them to get bored while I let the train creep along. I'd rather go aloittle fast and get the trains through tunnels and over bridges... and setting turnouts to alternative routes, etc.

But when I'm by myself, I run them probably around 10-15MPH at scale.

Prototypical Timetable speed for my layout is 30 MPH Passenger, 15 MPH, Freight. 10 MPH over most highway grade crossings, 5 MPH over one with major foot traffic at shift change time. My MR follows that closely. I can take over 30" to run a scale mile (61') in HO. There are times, when I loose patience with such speeds.

 

[Iron Horseman]

Prototype switching, is too much like work on some days.

I've often said when one gets too prototypical it does become work. example. There was a person here in Colorado who modeled one of the narrow gauge mining town's track layout exactly to scale. They operated 100% prototipically at prototypical speeds (no fast clock needed as the layout was real size). While it is a great work of historical preservation it was not only tedious to operate but also boring. When it takes over 15 real minutes to spot one car on a facing point mine spur. Especially with the owner standing over your shoulder saying you didn't wait long enough for the brakeman to connect the air lines...... That was the only operating session of hundreds (thousands?) I could not wait to get away from.

Same with the Microsoft Railroad simulator. Just what I don't want to do is spend 10 hours on a road turn taking a train through the Montana plains, adjusting the throttle ever so slightly, and occasionally pulling into a passing track to wait, and wait, and wait. Yawn. Blowing the horn at the grade crossings just right becomes the highlight of the event.

There is a reason railroads have to pay people to do these tasks.

 

[Iron Horseman]

There is a point to running trains prototypically slowly, especially on a smaller layout. I have one exception to this... The original shovelnose Pioneer Zephyr #9900 often hit 100 mph in certain places.

That is one of my beefs with the Walther's 1:14 gearing they are putting in all of their diesel locomotives (and apparently Rapido too), top speed is about 79mph. I run the Chief, the Super Chief, the El Capitan, the San Francisco Chief, the Fast Mail and Express, the Empire Builder, the Northcoast Limited, etc. None of those trains would have ever kept their schedules at 79mph max.

 

[dave1905]

Prototypical Timetable speed for my layout is 30 MPH Passenger, 15 MPH, Freight. 10 MPH over most highway grade crossings, 5 MPH over one with major foot traffic at shift change time. My MR follows that closely. I can take over 30" to run a scale mile (61') in HO. There are times, when I loose patience with such speeds.

30" to run one scale mile is 2 mph. Walking speed is 3-4 mph.

 

[Iron Horseman]

photo shows a Class J from the Norfolk & Western roaring past pop and the kids getting a thrill. Not the best place for dad to take the kids, but they'll never forget this experience.

Especially if they miss the train coming up on them on the passing track.

Here in the Denver area we just had an incedent where a policeman stopped his patrol car on the railroad track. Got the suspect out of the car (6 officers on the scene by now). Another officer cuffed the suspect and put them in the back of the cruiser sitting on the tracks. Then they were all so busy "clearing" the suspects vehicle talking about if she had thrown a weapon out the window or not they ignored the train whistle. All this caught on their body cameras. As they are discussing this you can hear the train blasting and blasting its horn. By the time they wake up to the situation it is too late and the train plows into the car with the hand cuffed person inside. The camera on one of the other police vehicles caught the actual crash.

https://www.ksat.com/news/2022/09/2...-train-with-female-suspect-handcuffed-inside/

What I can't figure out is what happened to the train? Shows them running to the hit car, but there is no train on the track they are running down.

 

[AirbrushNo5]

Well if u only have space for a 4 x 8… 4 x 8 or smaller it is…
whether it’s boring is all up to u…
Work with what u have

 

[boatwrench]

Ovals do not necessarily need to be boring. A folded oval allows for either a crossing at grade level or an incline and using a bridge to cross over the lower tracks. The layout my SIL and I built for my grandson using his dad's old train sets had both a folded oval and a figure 8 in the middle using 15 and18 inch radius sectional track. They both enjoy just watching the trains run.

I have always been impressed with the Gateway Central Project Railroads. Most are small, but every aspect of model railroading is incorporated. Interesting track work, a continuous oval, scenery building and of course modeling structures. Check the half dozen layouts here

Also, and most of the regular contributors to this informative forum are tired of me saying this, Bryon Henderson's take on Model Railroaders 4x8 The Virginian. The layout square footage is roughly 4x8 but it has been broken down into an around the walls. see below.

have fun.

 

[Guilford Railman]

I’ve stated a similar response to the forum mentioned by ctclibby but based off your question, you have to ask yourself “What kind of model railroader am I?”. Others have mentioned switching vs. continuous running or a combo of the two. If this is your first layout, start off simple. A simple loop of track with a spur or two on a 4 x 8 is a great start and can help spark new ideas. I forget what issue it was originally published in but Model Railroader did an article on the Madison Central layout. They also made a video series on how to build it. Here’s a link to a thread someone else created and they mentioned the track plan:

Don't know where to start - so many questions!

I have an approval from the CFO to build a train layout for our grand kids (that's my story) for Christmas. I have no experience but I've watched about 100 videos on you tube. I built a 4x8 table and I now need some track for on it. I'm not looking for a complex track plan, just something to get...

modelrailroadforums.com

 

[AirbrushNo5]

Actually those Gateway NMRA small layouts are great for the modeller that wants to pile on the detail…

 

[Boris]

30" to run one scale mile is 2 mph. Walking speed is 3-4 mph.

Amazing how slow these modern models will go without stalling. 10 mph is 6" per mile and I suppose that scales out, but that's too much like work also. Not for nothing, I adjust my running speed to what I judge to be track speed, and don't bother myself with measuring actual speed...FRA isn't allowed into my house .

 

[kleiner]

A full year after I completed the layout, I am still having a lot of fun operating Woodlawn Industrial Park, my 2 ft by 12 ft switching layout!

 

[Jaz avalley]

There are a lot of people who can barely manage. Small shelf switching area,and would give their eye teeth for an 8’x4’
1. Go small if you want more and have the hand dexterity, n gauge is well supported and will inevitably give yo twice as much as h0 or 00.
2. If you have a wall and are not in an open space you can have a tunnel entering and leaving a space offering two areas, I have seen this done very successfully,
3. You can have lift out portions, or pull out areas to enlarge the space, some people at shows add cassettes so t rains can be stored off layout ready to drive in at a seconds notice,
4. Willie has two levels doubling his capacity, and it is well worth a look at for clever ideas
5. And as for boring - the only limit is your imagination
6. And you can seasonally change a single layout I do this from time to time myself, especially for Xmas.
and here are some ideas
Plus if you go for a specific time period with a sp edifice railway and look at ones with not so long consists you will have the joys of getting the minute details up to scratch as time goes on, only one of these is rounds roundy I love the quirky walnut shells turned into wagons ingenuity, plus there’s the Beatles tribute,some magnificent scenic work done by a guy who is in a wheelchair, and I added my punks, if you can choose a moment in time of your own life span or memories or a moment that touches your heart you will find it a labour of love, and enjoy for many years

 

[Jaz avalley]

Weather, so this area is, with and without snow, spring autumn works also.

1980s Britain a small English village, the train runs to the rear but I admit I do not add snow even tho I have a snow plough as it is the wrong era

my updated figures portraying punks, and one brave mod on his scooter

Snow came early no winter coats….bbbbrrrrrr

although a side benefit fresh frozen ice cream

the foam I use yellows anyway after a month or two so a light brush with a decorators paint brush then a mini hoover and it all goes back to ‘normal’ so 2 for 1.
You could do a large oval with 4 quarters for 4 seasons, with track leading into the middle and a station, outside a small passenger stop and may just be able to fit in sone industry.
FYI the buildings you see here are 00 but Hornby SKaledale do n gauge or did evil bay may help you with some nice buildings,now I suspect your going US layout you could do a nice small town scene and some bikers although whenever I have looked for biker figures the prices have been jaw dropping.

 

[Jaz avalley]

Oh and almost forgot never overlook low relief buildings offering an impression of more room, you can even add roads leading of low relief inferring more space.