Elevation question


J

jaltbaum

New Member
I should be able to do this, I did graduate college, but I have a question for everyone regarding elevation. I am planning an "N" scale layout which is an 8'x4' length wise in an L shape butted up against a 6'x4'. I plan on having the track rise at a two degree angle for six feet. My question is how high with the track be after traveling upwards at a two degree climb over the course of six feet?! Also, is there an easy way to calculate this since I don't want to bug you all with this everytime I am reconfiguring :)

Thanks!
 
HHMMMMMMMM.......I've never heard anyone ask a grade question this way. You normally figure grades as a percent, not a degree. And usually you have a height in mind you need to reach....for example you need 2 inches of elevation to have one track pass over another. Did you mean you wanted to have your track have a 2% grade for 6 feet? In that case grade = rise/run or in this case .02 = X / 72 inches........or 72 X .02 = 1.44 inches. So a 2% grade for 6 feet would get you 1.44 inches of elevation. If you really meant a 2 degree slope, your on your own.....my geometry isn't that good anymore.
 
Elevation

Wow, you asked the right question!!! So, I needed to ask my question better. My goal is to have my trains go into a tunnel (hidden from view) and go up up up up up until it is in a mountain type area, come out of a tunnel, cross a bridge that is seemingly much higher than the other track on the layout... maybe this would be 1' higher than the table? I just figured that a 2 percent grade would allow a long train to be able to do this since any steeper and the train may not make it with 15-20 car load.

Also, I am new to this and will ask questions strangely as I apparently did before. Hopefully I made sense this time.
 
You'll need at least 9 feet to get a 2% grade up to a 2.5 inch elevation and it would actually be more like 10.5 feet if you count space for grade transition. If I understand your question correctly, you're asking about going up one foot? You would need about 650 inches of run to get up one foot on a 2% grade. That's a little over 54 feet. :eek: You would need either a warehouse or a big helix to accomplish this. You might want to rethink your plans.
 
I think I am going the helix route. I am trying to go up one foot, so I will need a ton of track... But this creates a new question... In "N" Scale, what is the safest radius for a helix? I plan on running deisel locos, but honestly I would like toe be able to run a Big Boy on my layout just for fun ( I have always wanted to own one). I just don't want that skipping off the helix.
 
Is there some reason you want 1 ft of elevation? What are you going to do once the train gets up there? A helix is normally more associated with having a multi-level layout...as in 2 layouts, one above the other, connected by the helix. Also, once you get up there, you need to get back down, which would require a reversing loop, a second helix, or backing down. I guess you could also have a yard as your destination, where you break down the train, make up a new train, and send it back down. The reason I ask is a helix will take up A LOT of space...to be safe and have the fewest problems, you should probably have at least 3 ft square to do the helix. That's a big chunk of your layout, unless you have room to add more on. You could probably get away with 2 ft using 11 inch radius curves, but even with a 2% grade you'd be somewhat limited in how long of a train you could run......a tighter radius curve has a lot more drag, so your 2% 11 inch radius helix would probably act more like 3.5 or 4 % grade.
 
To add to what Dave wrote, a one foot rise in elevation is huge in N scale and even a helix leaves a question as to how you are going to get the train back down again. A helix is difficult to build and the continuous curve will make a 2% grade at the bottom act like a 4% grade on the train by the time it gets to the top.

If you want your train to appear to be crossing a large canyon after exiting the tunnel, have you though about depressing the canyon below grade level and having the bridge at or slightly above grade? The effect will be the same as the large climb up the grade but it will be a lot easier to build and won't limit you curve radius to the helix curves.
 
This is why I asked the experts... So, I will do a helix for my upper level and do the canyon recessed below grade... this should work out perfect... maybe I only need to go up 6" or a tad less then... thankfully I have a ton of room for the helix... I want to be able to have 3 tracks going around it for a couple different levels and for a loop... i need to draw it up and show you all... i love this board and am learning so much!
 
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