What happened to my decals????

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S

stang_crazy

Member
Ok so here is the recent UP AC4400 I did w/ microscale decals I also used micorsol & micro set on everything.

But as ya can see in the pics there is one major problem with the UP logo and the we will deliver logo. I sprayed it in clear (flat) last night and this morning this is what I found.......

:eek: NOW What??? Will weathering even cover this up ya think or am i gonna have to strip the whole thing??? Ive never had this happen before.

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Mike
 
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Hi, I joined this forum today. In my passed experience with decaling I found that if I used clear gloss coat as a base to set the decal on it would adhere much better to the contours of the surface of the model. Everything else sounds to be right. I mean with your use of micro sol. When all decaling is done, one to two day drying time then shoot with dul coat. Should be good to go from there!! Scott.
 
Mike,

That is commonly called ghosting. It's where the decals did not seat completely down on the surface, and now the air pockets are visible. One question, did you clear coat your engine before doing the decals?? Once you sealed it with dull-coat, poof they appear. You have 2 choices here #1 trying to get them to seal now or #2 strip it and start over.

#1 Your using Micro-Scale's Micro Solv\Micro set. Take a brand new #11 x-acto blade, score lines where the ghosting is, use only the Micro-set, try to work the bubbles out with your brush. You may have to repeat this several times over the course of a couple of days until the ghosting is gone.

#2 Try to strip the decals by soaking them in the Micro-sol. Not going to work too well because you've already applied dull-coat. Strip the entire engine, start over.

Before you seal your decals down with anything, it's always a good idea to look at them under a very bright light at an angle. You'll see any ghosting that is there. And I'd never seal decals with dull-coat first. Always clear coat!! Then if you like you can dull-coat over that.

My humble 2 cents, I'm sure the other members can add to this.
 


No i applyed the decals right onto the paint. I let the decals sit to dry for prolly 4-5 days then last night i sprayed the flat clear coat on it and this morning is when i found the issue.

SO even though there cleared over will cutting through and useing microset even work.?
 
stang_crazy said:
No i applyed the decals right onto the paint. I let the decals sit to dry for prolly 4-5 days then last night i sprayed the flat clear coat on it and this morning is when i found the issue.

SO even though there cleared over will cutting through and useing microset even work.?
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Mike, I'd say no. Strip the entire thing and start over. Here's my process for doing an engine.

Undecorated or stripped engine

#1 wash in hot soapy water
#2 let air dry for a day or two (or use a blow dryer)
#3 primer (24 hour dry time)
#4 base coat color (24 hour dry time)
#5 gloss coat (24 hour dry time)
#6 secondary color (24 hour dry time)
#7 gloss coat (24 hour dry time) :eek: this is the step you missed
#8 decals (24 hour dry time)
#9 gloss coat (24 hour dry time)
#10 weathering (24 hour dry time)
#11 dull-coat (24 hour dry time)

You must give the decals a nice smooth surface to adhere to. Decals do not work very well over paint. It's not a smooth surface, Gloss then decals. Not flat finish either, that will leave another form of ghosting.

I know this isn't what you wanted to hear at this point. But I'm trying to help you out. And trust me, I've done what you did too in the past. It's a pain to learn it all the hard way. :)
 
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jerome, jerome, jerome............

starting over is the last thing i wanted to hear lol. I think as one last step im gonna try and make a few cuts and soak some microset on it and see what happens, then just for the heck of it ill throw some grimey black on it.

If it covers it great if not then ill start over. Ill at least try to salvage it then next time ill now.

I must say out of all the decals ive ever done this ive alwaus put the decals on the painted surface them cleared and ive never ran into this problem.

Ill let ya know the results.
 
Mike, depends on the paint. Floquil is mostly a flat finish paint and leaves a very un-even surface. Now some of their newer gloss paints, you can skip the gloss-coat step. If the paint already has a glossy finish to it. Let us know how it turns out.
 
well since its only them 2 areas ive deicded what im gonna do. gonna tape everything off except to big areas on the side scrape/sand the decal/clear and resray then areas yellow clear coat it, put new decals on and re clear it again.

Also is there anything besides testors dull coat thatll work the same? Right now for my clear im using krylon flat clear.
 
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stang_crazy said:
yeah same here i thought recently ive heard others using something else made by krylon to i thought and ya get more for less price.
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Mike, I use what works for me. Buy the larger bottles and mix it to your taste. One little bottle lasts me a long time. Price isn't always the only consideration. ;)
 
Its getting stripped now anyways. So im gonna go ahead and order some floquil paint and go that route and give the airbrush a try also.
 
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See, I just pick up some helpful info. Thank you Jerome, I will try the gloss coat over the decal as well as under. I was tot to seal the decal in with the dul but this sounds more solid and stable.
 
Yep you got air trapped under the decal or the decal dried and has not set properly on the surface. I use water based paints and will gloss the engine shell before I place the decal on. I use micro scale decal softner to get them to set on a uneven surface. after 30 mins - hour of drying and can see that the water has evaparated I place a light coat of gloss over the surface to seal them in. Some times you can re wet the decal and get water back under them. if this is possible you can re seal them properly.

Trent
 
Seems to have been answered fully, but I agree, looks like air trapped, use one gloss cote, or future before you decal.
 
I use Krylon Matte Finish spray for "dullcoting" models all the time. It seems to work as well as the other brands of matte spray for a lot less money. As has been said, the top coat is not the problem, it's the bottom coat. When I paint with Flouquil flat colors, I use about 10% Crystalcote as part of the thinner. For darker colors, like boxcar red, this usually adds just enough gloss to get a good decal job. On lighter colors, like Armour Yellow, an absolutely smooth and glossy surface is mandatory, especially for large roadname decals. I follow Jereome's steps whenever I'm painting UP models.
 
Decal rescue

Sometimes you can use Scotch tape to lift decals that don't adhere. The layer of Dullcoat might be a problem, but the tape might save the need to strip the paint.
With Scalecoat II you should have had a gloss surface, but a light spray of gloss or satin finish always helps.
When you re-decal, paint a thin layer of MicroSet before you slide the decal on to the surface, than apply the MicroSol before the decal dries completely. That ought to help it pull down onto the surface.
I found out the hard way that having the house too cold seems to cause this. Might want to be sure your work area is warmed up to 68 or 70F.
 
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I rarely gloss my engines. It's not impossible to repair without gloss. You can settle the decals down by using a fresh xacto blade (as mentioned) and lightly scribe along door edges and poke tiny holes in latches etc and dab solvaset over the cuts you made and the liquid will wick in behind the decal. Lay the model flat and let the solvaset do the work. You may return to find the silvering gone, but there is now tiny bubbles all over the surface of the decal. Repeat the process by pricking all the bubbles and dab with solvaset until the decal is set properly.

I have done this process to boxcars I've purchased from modelers with silvered decals 10+ years old...
 
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