Taking a beating on EBAY lately

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I didn't get to read the whole thread, but just in case it has not already been suggested: You can file a "not as described" complaint through Paypal. They serve as a mediator for your communications with the seller, and put things "on record". If the seller does not cooperate, after 2 weeks or so, you can escalate it to a claim. When you do this, Paypal takes the money back from the seller and holds it until the problem is resolved. This usually "motivates" the seller to make things right. Erie is not the sale as Erie-lackawanna, and you should not have to accept what you did not bargain for. Be persistent enough, and a good seller will refund shipping charges too, once you show them you are serious.

Knock wood, I usually do well on ebay, buying and selling all sorts of things, from model trains, to coupons, to cars.
 
Ebay used to be THE TICKET for model trains and such. It was the BEST way to find obscure goodies as local train shops just didn't have everything under the sun. But thru time, as with most things, the place has just deteriorated to scum. I signed up for the place almost ten years ago, bought boup coup HO trains to substantiate the huge 10' x 22' layout I had in the basement of the house....then turned around years later and started selling when I had moved...well combined with the change of rules in regards to feedback, and the scope of attitude and lattitude of buyers and sellers...(it's funny how Ebay eliminated the exercise of money orders and/or personal checks to pay, but equally sad that if it weren't for PayPal, there would be LOTS more corruption WITHOUT recourse. And btw, that's NOT a compliment on Ebay!) anyway, I just don't have the time to waste with that kind of loosing proposition. I still have a balance DUE ME for the last bunch of bids that were awarded, and then the winning bidders never paid for...hense the return of the listing costs...which will rot in hell....
 
I had one "oops.....sent the wrong item" problem recently. I notified the seller, recieved a reply that they had misread the item (supposed to be Chicago Northwestern, but was Norfolk Western) with an apology, a refund and was told to keep the item I had recieved. I couldn't really complain....just had to start shopping again. Obviously not done on purpose.
 


Just a responce for the section where ya said you put in the item desription that payment is to be made 4 days after auctions end. You can put 2 days or 2 hours it dont matter.

ebays rules say the buyer has either 7 or 10 days after auctions end to pay. So putting that ya want payment 2 minutes after the auctions end is pointless. Ya have to wait 7 days before you can even file a NPB complaint.

I was not aware of that, thanks for pointing that out to me, i guess i should change that in my policy lol
 
Here is how you solve that problem. ALWAYS sell with immediate payment required. This way, the buyer can not end your auction using buy-it-now, without first paying. If you list everything with buy-it-now and pay now, it's impossible for a deadbeat bidder to waste your time. If you want to allow lower offers than your buy-now price, you can also allow best offer too. then you can decide if you want to accept the offer, and they have to pay to end the auction, just like buy-now.

As far as buying goes, I always look out for ANY negative remarks in the feedback. Also, a seller with a billion feedbacks is usually very busy, and in my experience, doesn't give very good service because they are too busy shipping.

I think just following those two "rules" had gone a long way to making my ebay buys and sells go pretty smoothly.
 
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I have bought a lot of items off of ebay including some big ticket items like my Cobra and have only had a couple of issues with one seller and one buyer. I sold quite a few HO items last summer and by the time Ebay and Paypal got their fees I may as well of kept the loco's or tossed them in the garbage [Athearn RTR & Genesis]. Lately I have been buying and selling on the HO Yard Sale and find it much better to do business on there.
 
AS far as purchasing items, I've actually been ripped of worse right here on the forums...

Kid was selling his HO stiff to swap to N, I paid $75 for a Spectrum -9, and some wheelsets and couplers. I only got the -9 and it was missing handrails, and fuel tanks, and body mount screws, and... the little twerp just kept making excuses...

I've got burnt on ebay 2x, and once was because I didnt inspect the item for several months (it came while I was moving, and it's not a big loss, Spectrum F-40 PH with a damaged pilot. Ive got enough LL spares from my B unit porject to fix it...)
the 2nd time I bought a Roadrailer coupler mate, and the seller never sent it and didnt respond to my emails. I waited the proper time, files a claim and got my refund.

Living out here, Ebay is still my "local hobby shop". I do ahve some good sellers, and soem can even get what I need that they don't have.

2 stores I recommend are:
THE FAVORITE SPOT Good NIB dealer. I once won 5 Spectrum E-33's and they came in the Bachmann shipping box. Oh yea, all auctions ended between $35-$45. Bid snipers will have a blast here. Most auctions start at $0.01

VANDALIA_HOBBY RR club in Missouri that operates an Ebay store for club revenue. They can get items that you need that you can't find elsewhere. Or that I've found elsewhere, and just wanted to deal with them...
 
As a buyer I've never had any troubles. I take my time and read everything I can. If I have any confusion I ask the buyer.

As a seller I've had a few instances. One fella took his time making payment. I sent him a few emails. After about 10 days I gave him a non paying bidder strike. He had the nerve to call me on the phone. Threaten to have my accounts closed by making false claims. Needless to say that did not go over very well for him.

Some buyers don't read the item description at all. When it clearly states " I will combine shipping" They still email me to ask. Also my auctions state that I only use Priority Mail. I only charge exact shipping. They still leave less then a five star rating. (I have a 4.9 I think) THis to me is where the feedback system is flawed. They knew exactly what they were in for before they bid. Why pay it then get grumpy about it? Shipping time is another one I can't stand. If I can ship the same day I do. Most times it's the next day no exceptions. All my listings say shipped within one day. I have a 4.7 on that one I think. The only thing I can control... Item description and Communication I have a five star rating. Go figure.


All in all I am satisfied with being a buyer. As a seller it's getting more expensive and aggrevating.
 
Lately I have been buying and selling on the HO Yard Sale and find it much better to do business on there.
What's this HO Yard Sale? Web site? :confused:

Despite all the flaws, I honestly don't know what I would do WITHOUT ebay. It's the first place I look for just about everything. Just have to be careful and do some research on the seller. Like I said, when you sell, always require immediate payment. Then you NEVER have to worry about non-paying bidder. Ebay also has options so you can set it up so nobody with more than a couple negatives can bid on your item, or nobody with less than xx feedback can bid. I have unloaded LOTS of stuff I never would have been able to sell if I did not have a global audience.

<begin rant> (this is not directed at anyone)

I understand it doesn't work for everyone, but you have to consider all the benefits - nothing is perfect. Or, put another way, if they try to "legislate" all the risk out, that will mean even higher fees, and then it will be useless, because there won't be any deals. I'd rather have access to it, and have a little risk tolerance, than not have it at all. Think about the "fun" things in this world that have had 100% of the worry taken out of them to please every single complainant. The costs of doing that either (a) takes all the fun out of it or (b) makes it too expensive. Just my 2 cents....

<end rant, flame away> :D:D:D:D:D
.
 
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Speaking of taking a beating... I just uploaded a few things on evilbay and got this message when I mentioned money orders in the description:

"Please review your item. It appears that you are offering money order as a payment method which is no longer permitted in the eBay marketplace. As of January 15th, we will be removing any items that offer this payment method within the listing. Sellers must offer to accept one or more of the following payment methods
*Paypal
*Credit or debit card processed through an Internet merchant account
*Propay
Sellers may in addition offer to accept Payment Upon Pickup.
Please revise your listing by removing the banned payment method. Based on the safety concerns and input from the Community, eBay has established an Accepted Payments policy that clarifies eBay's position on payment methods."

Sheesh!:mad:
 
Sure, it's a bit of a nuisance to not be able to put the word "money order" in your listing. I found that a bit surprising too. Simply don't do that. In the payment types accepted area, just put "contact me for payment instructions" or something like that. People will get it. Ebay must protect themselves legally. Welcome to the United States of America.

When you do business as a company in the US, you have to always keep in mind that when someone is wronged, they will take everyone within 100 yards to court. Especially nowadays when every business is perceived as "evil". Legal disclaimers are worth nothing. You still have to invest the time and money and personnel to defend yourself.

I say, blame it on lawyers, blame it on elected officials, blame it on what the country has turned into. Don't blame ebay for protecting themselves from a runaway legal system and the litigious "help me I can't think for myself" culture. This country allows those without common sense (buyer sending cash to unknown seller) to blame everyone else (ebay in this case) on their ignorance, even when those other parties (ebay) are not responsible for what happened. Ebay is perceived as an enabler of the fraud, by the frivolous litigator. As ebay, would you not defend yourself? Or would you prefer to spend more time in court? Would you rather employ an even bigger army of attorneys full time?

Sorry, but every time I hear someone complain about policies and blame it on the company, I can't help but think they don't really know how infuriating it is to do business in this country. Then we wonder why businesses move operations overseas. Can you really blame them?
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Sure, it's a bit of a nuisance to not be able to put the word "money order" in your listing. I found that a bit surprising too. Simply don't do that. In the payment types accepted area, just put "contact me for payment instructions" or something like that. People will get it.
.

And putting "contact me for payment instructions" in your listing will get your listing bumped off! E-Bay doesn't want "other" forms of payment. That's why they banned checks and money orders. I got away with a few listings that stated that I would accept money orders for items that were picked up. I did get a notice from e-Bay and I argued that their rules ALLOWED money orders on pickups. They left my listings alone, but I later read the rules more carefully and determined that money orders on pickups applied only to certain categories, not model railroading items! On my next listings, I dropped the money order option. Besides, I didn't really want a bunch of strangers dropping by my home! LOL

Another thing I learned by reading the rules carefully is that BUYERS can request to use money orders for payment! I did that just recently with an auction I won from GATCO (EGATCO on e-Bay). Larry (Gatco) HATES PayPal. He has run his e-Bay listings without PayPal for years until e-Bay made it nearly impossible to list items without a PayPal payment option. I have since learned that Larry is closing his business on e-Bay and moving to another site.

E-Bay is making things difficult for us "little" sellers, like me, who sell unwanted or unneeded items for what I call hobby purposes (not running a business). When I have surplus items, I list them on e-Bay, almost always starting out at 99 cents. I'd like them to go to someone who can use them. Many times, if I knew someone who needed something I no longer wanted, I'd GIVE it to them! It's just a HOBBY to me, folks, not a business!!

Eventually I'll start working on my "Dream Layout" and begin using the things I've stockpiled for years in anticipation of that event. When I'm far enough along on it, I'll have determined what items can be considered surplus (track, turnouts, structure kits, rolling stock, locos, whatever). Then I'll list it on e-Bay (if they're still in business or still allowing "little guys" to sell!)

I use e-Bay a lot to determine the "street" value of items I'm interested in. With the big push by e-Bay to encourage large sellers and Buy-It-Now auctions, it isn't difficult to figure out when I can buy something locally for the same price or a few dollars more and not have to wait to get it. Many times, I can find the item of interest locally at a BETTER price than what I see on e-Bay!

Until something else comes along, e-Bay is the "big" game in town when it comes to online auctioning. But it isn't as much fun as it used to be when it was more like a flea market than a big department store!

That's my 2 cents worth, anyway.

Darrell, quiet...for now
 
Oh I can understand the Cover Yer Ass aspect of it all, and as said sending cash to strangers can be foolish no matter what the circumstance these days.
It's just that I'm not a fan of paypal (altho I do use it when I have to) and money orders are just so easy to send, cash, and trace.
I do know what you are saying about the state of legalities, as a dealer of used railroad equipment I have to be very careful myself. I sold some relay ties to someone who pounded them into a river bank as part of his landscaping. When he was told to remove them and threatened with a fine by the environmental people he tried to put it back on me.... not sure what he was thinking.
Anyway the auction goes on! :D
 
For those who did not know - PayPal is owned by eBay. They can now triple dip on collecting - listing fee, final value fee & PayPal fee.
 
What's this HO Yard Sale? Web site? :confused:

...

<begin rant> (this is not directed at anyone)

I understand it doesn't work for everyone, but you have to consider all the benefits - nothing is perfect. Or, put another way, if they try to "legislate" all the risk out, that will mean even higher fees, and then it will be useless, because there won't be any deals. I'd rather have access to it, and have a little risk tolerance, than not have it at all. Think about the "fun" things in this world that have had 100% of the worry taken out of them to please every single complainant. The costs of doing that either (a) takes all the fun out of it or (b) makes it too expensive. Just my 2 cents....

<end rant, flame away> :D:D:D:D:D
.

Mike, there certainly is the element of risk tolerance and risk avoidance, but there is also being "taken", and not being able to do much about it. That part bothers me. It is true that you may have recourse, even most often, but that someone would take advantage of me is what galls me the most. Ebay is probably no worse than any other millieu. It is, after all, like our armed forces, our school systems, our hospitals....they attract all sorts of characters and personalities. There will be some bad people involved in your education, health care, and who will be given weapons in order to protect you.

Yet, my choice is to avoid the "meat market", my characterization, and deal strictly with reputable, predictable, and integral members of the retail supply chain. I can still find the bargains, and by doing the same type of research. Even then, nothing precludes the purchaser from contacting the seller in either place and attempting to negotiate an even better deal. I have done that successfully outside of ebay...and was rewarded with a modest reduction in the price advertised. In fact, the person pulled his item off ebay (legally) and let me have it because it was, after all, a sure thing.

I feel there must be a greater appeal to ebay than merely getting deals. I believe it is a neo-competitive place where some personalities, probably less risk-averse than I, enjoy the bidding and winning process as much, or more, than the prospect of owning the item. The focus for me, who had been a competitor successfully in other areas of my life, is in the object for sale. When I part with cash for it, even if a single dollar, the idea is that I am to have the benefit of its use... exclusively. In exchange the seller will get the exclusive use of my dollar.

-Crandell
 
For those who did not know - PayPal is owned by eBay. They can now triple dip on collecting - listing fee, final value fee & PayPal fee.

An excellent business model, and then only in response to those who began to complain of rip-offs and other advantage-seeking behaviours.

Any ethical organization will respond to complaints and take measures to reduce them to the extent possible under existing legislation. A sound business will also avail itself of opportunities to ensure its longevity and solid return on investment. In that respect, I'd say ebay does very well indeed.

No one who uses its services is required to sign an oath of loyalty, or even to show any overt appreciation for any successes they enjoy in their "pursuit of happiness" via ebay. Still, millions scramble to try to "steal" the latest "deal" every hour of every day.

-Crandell
 


there is also being "taken", and not being able to do much about it. That part bothers me. It is true that you may have recourse, even most often, but that someone would take advantage of me is what galls me the most..... Yet, my choice is to avoid the "meat market", my characterization

I agree. For me, I'm willing to put up with the annoyances, because I find things on ebay that I can not get anywhere else. I also sell things on ebay that I could never unload without the "global marketplace" as they like to call it.

I totally understand not wanting to be "taken" by someone. The attitude from some which I can not understand, is to demonize ebay, rather than the lying sellers and deadbeat buyers that abuse it. As if a background check should be done on everyone. You dont seem to hold any bad feelings towards ebay itself, you just make an informed choice not to expose yourself to the potential aggravation.

and deal strictly with reputable, predictable, and integral members of the retail supply chain.

I try to buy locally too, whenever possible. If I need something "now", that's not possible with ebay. When the price is reasonable, I support the local shops. I tend to not haggle on price because their very presence is a service and I'm willing to pay a premium for the luxury of instant gratification and good service. For model trains there is only one shop here, and sadly it's really a joke. The next closest one is an hour drive away. For other things, I find that many local stores consistently "abuse" me about as much as ebay's sellers might. Telling me they have something when they do not, and so on. My local hobby shop did that once already. I called, asked if the parts I had ordered came in. They said yes. I got there, and they said no (the same person!) It is far more irritating when a person looks you in the eye and makes a deal then doesn't do what they said they would do, and I've had that happen to me much more than it should. Just try dealing with building contractors, for example. On ebay, I don't expect too much, yet I am almost always pleasantly surprised.

I believe it is a neo-competitive place where some personalities, probably less risk-averse than I, enjoy the bidding and winning process as much, or more, than the prospect of owning the item.

I really HOPE that this is NOT the mindset of 99% of those using ebay. I mean, how childish are people? Wait, nevermind, I know the answer already... However, when I'm a seller, I am all for that mentality of course. I've sold used things on ebay for higher than retail, and in some cases I even had a link to the retailer with the lower price. It can be a weird place.

When I part with cash for it, even if a single dollar, the idea is that I am to have the benefit of its use... exclusively. In exchange the seller will get the exclusive use of my dollar.

Maybe because I tend to buy and sell things that few people want, I "need" a diverse marketplace like ebay. I am willing to put up with risk, willing to pay fees, and maybe even be ripped off once in a long while (I have not yet), whether I'm buying or selling, to have that worldwide fleamarket.
 
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