ModelRailroadForums.com is a free Model Railroad Discussion Forum and photo gallery. We cover all scales and sizes of model railroads. Online since 2002, it's one of the oldest and largest model railroad forums on the web. Whether you're a master model railroader or just getting started, you'll find something of interest here.
Guys, I am new to railroading and found out the hard way about reverse loops. I decided to bag the idea of trying to make it work. However, I didn't realize there was a way to run more than 1 train on a track? If I create sidings can I run more than one - do I need any special wiring or equipment for that? Whenever I try to add more than 1 train, both go at the same time - what I am doing wrong?
If you have a local hobby shop, there are many good books on basic wiring for any scale layout. DCC might be a bit too expensive for starters. Using insulated rail jointers and controllers, you can have many trains sitting on the tracks, but only 1 or 2 running. Look for the Atlas Basic Wiring book, it's where I started many years ago. Best of luck with your layout, and welcome!!!
Guys, really appreciate it! I am also new to forums, so this was a little different for me, but a great source of info - will get that book tomorrow - thanks again!
I completely disagree. In the long run, it'll be cheaper to go DCC. Especially since that is what the market is going to.
I got my Prodigy Express DCC system on Ebay for $100. Works GREAT. I can run two trains at the same time, and at crawling speeds far slower than DC controllers can do.
Not only that, I don't need to isolate sidings to let trains go by, etc. I can let one train run loops and move the other train between sidings while the train running loops continues on.
If you're completely starting from scratch with this hobby, DCC is the best way to start.
I completely disagree. In the long run, it'll be cheaper to go DCC. Especially since that is what the market is going to.
I got my Prodigy Express DCC system on Ebay for $100. Works GREAT. I can run two trains at the same time, and at crawling speeds far slower than DC controllers can do.
Not only that, I don't need to isolate sidings to let trains go by, etc. I can let one train run loops and move the other train between sidings while the train running loops continues on.
If you're completely starting from scratch with this hobby, DCC is the best way to start.
What I meant by for starters is skill level. I know 30 some years ago when I first started with HO trains, I would have been in over my head with something like DCC. Starting with the basics is also a good learning tool for better understanding of how everything works. But as with everything I say, It's all just my humble opinion.
Definitely will consider it. I have a train up and running now. I was trying to get my son into the hobby, and all of a sudden, I am adding a second level with a mountain and all sorts of stuff! Fear what you ask for! Anyway, on the second level is where I tried to do an oval and then added a crossing section where I discovered the reverse loop problem. Will DCC correct for that too - or is that where we also have to start insulating track?
DCC would solve the reverse loop trouble. With DCC basically the track is hot all of the time, you have a decoder in each engine, with your controller you tell each engine what to do, or they could just be sitting there doing nothing.
Awesome - again, thanks for the help. I just went to e-bay and saw one for ~$80.00, where I learned that the engines must be DCC ready also. Will definitely consider it, for now, I think I will stay the course and add some sidings for interest, and start saving my cash for the DCC upgrade!
Realistically, the learning curve for most DCC systems is short.
My prodigy express, for example, was as simple as plugging 3 things in and wiring up the track. Then a making sure I had the decoder equipped engine, I was running it in a matter of seconds. Super easy!
The way the hobby is going, everyone will be DCC sooner than later, and it'll be tougher and tougher to find DC equipment. That's just the way the hobby is going. It's the future of model railroading.
The beauty of it is, it's much more realistic, and gives far better train control! Most DCC systems have walk around cabs, so if your table is more than 5' in length, you can walk where you need to to uncouple cars, etc.
i know i've read countless threads on dcc and pretty much understood it but for some reason this thread made much more understandable. maybe its my add meds
I agree that if you're just starting out DCC isn't that much more than DC. And if you'll never have more than a few engines it isn't bad either. Sadly, just like most things electronic, there is a "planned obsolescence" and new systems will keep coming along that make todays DCC look like DCC makes DC look today , just like CD's have replaced records and 8-tracks and cassette tapes. And most computer software written today won't run on computers even 2 or 3 years old. I'm seeing a lot of criticism of DCC because of the dirty rail/bad signal issue, with talk of RC control like the model airplane guys have. And there's still no standards.....manufacturers are building "DCC ready" engines, but no one is building the decoders that are supposed to fit (drop in type...you can always hardwire a decoder, but that's outside a lot of peoples expertise). I'm still in the "great idea, work the bugs out and call me" group. That said, DCC is the best thing....for now. Bottom line....pick one and have fun....and know you're NEVER done with your train ! Wheeler is partially wrong about DCC solving the reverse loop problem....electrically speaking this situation will ALWAYS be a short circuit. There IS a special control circuit you can buy for DCC that solves the problem, just as there is a controller for DC to deal with the problem, but DCC by itself won't solve the problem. DCC has a lot of advantages for operations, but don't put off starting your layout till you can afford it.....A layout wired for DC is super easy to convert, so just make sure your new engines are DCC ready (most DCC equiped engines will run on DC too, you just may not have all functions....like lights) and have fun till you can get a DCC system.
great info - thanks! Can you recommend a certain brand , and model, of DCC that I could get into that is less than $80? I saw some Bachman DCC equipped engines today for ~$45, which I thought was good, but they didn't carry DCC transformers.
I'd definitely go DCC right from the start. As others have suggested, maybe buy a starter system on ebay. You can even find used ones that other folks have outgrown, and get them at a real deal.
It's so much easier and better than conventional DC, that most model railroaders are converting over. If you're just starting, it's definitely the way to go.
great info - thanks! Can you recommend a certain brand , and model, of DCC that I could get into that is less than $80? I saw some Bachmann DCC equipped engines today for ~$45, which I thought was good, but they didn't carry DCC transformers.
You're still confused. The Bachmann engines you saw probably said "DCC Equipped" or words to that effect. Bachmann has a number of engines in that price range that already have the DCC decoders installed. That means you put them on the track and run them with DCC immediately. Other engines will say something Like "DCC Ready", which means, in most cases, there is already a board with an NMRA eight or nine pin connector. You buy a decoder that fits that engine, remove the body shell, and simply plug in the decoder. It should then be ready to run under DCC.
If you keep an eye on e-bay, you can pick up a Bachmann E-Z Command DCC controller for $60 or less. There are several Bachmann engines under $50 that already have the DCC decoder installed. The engines have pretty good detail, run well, and will work with any DCC system. The E-Z Command system is a starter level DCC controller and doesn't have all the fancy functions of more expensive decoders. It is also very simple to understand and install. It will do all the major functions like lighting control and momentum control. It will also control all the major functions of sound-equipped locomotives. You can also run one DC engine from the controller along with DCC engines. I'm running the system now with six different DCC engines including a sound-equipped Walthers Proto GP-7. I can run three different engines at a time without overloading the system and it has has been trouble free. I bought it because I wanted to get my feet wet with DCC without investing a lot of money. At some point, I will move up to a controller that has more functions now that I understand DCC better but it has been a very good and inexpensive way to try out DCC and see if you like it.
Jim,
I think you're confused...or I'm confused....well, someone is confused. I think what DC was saying was his shop had engines (DCC equipped) but no DCC controllers. I totally agree with your assesment of the Bachmann system.
In answer to recommendations, a lot depends on your expectations. As Jim said, the Bachmann system doesn't have all the bells and whistles of some of the higher dollar systems......if you don't need or want all those extra features the Bachmann system is a good deal......As I mentioned in a previous post, I don't see DCC staying where it is today.....it was only a year or so ago that sound was hardly ever seen. Now it's becoming pretty common. My point being that DCC is in a major growth spurt and the Bachmann system might be a good way to " get your feet wet" without spending a lot of money. That way when you want a new system in a couple of years with all the new features ( I'm personally holding out for DCC controlled couplers!) you won't feel too bad dumping the old system. On the other hand, if you're a "if it works , why change" type of person (like some of us old DC holdouts) you might want to spend the extra money for a better system, knowing you'll be keeping it for many years to come.
If you want to keep it under $80, I think Bachmann is your only choice....you might pick a used system up, but buying used electronics on ebay is always a risk.
I, too, was looking at the bachmann ez command system.
I figured, due to the size of my layout and the possibility for expansion in the future with a second cab, I went and purchased the MRC Prodigy Express. Bought it for $90 slightly used on ebay. Works perfectly, and I can buy a prodigy advance squared handheld for $70 and plug it right in, and it'll work with my existing system, and give me more features.
Very easy to use, and easily upgradeable to future NMRA standards that MRC comes out with.
I'd say it's worth it to get in DCC at this point. Prices are lower, the technology is clear and knowledge of it is fairly widespread.
MRLDave,
Now that I have re-read DC's message, I see what you're saying. I think your interpretation was correct - what he meant was the LHS didn't have any DCC controllers in stock. Hopefully DC will post and let us know if that's what he really meant so both of us won't be confused forever.
You make an excellent point about the Bachmann E-Z Command system which I don't think is addressed very often. There are some major DCC changes on the horizon including those DCC couplers you're waiting for. What is a "high end " system today will need upgrading to keep up with the changes. Of course, you don't have to keep up with the changes but I suspect newer locomotives will almost require upgrades if you want to get your money's worth out of what you paid for the locomotive. I just ordered 12 decoders to bring up my entire fleet to DCC. That, along with my Bachmann system, will allow me to putter along for a year, maybe two, before I decide I just have to have whatever the newest whiz-bang system offers. By that time, maybe I'll understand all this stuff. I won't feel bad putting the Bachmann system on e-bay and maybe getting $25 or $30 from someone else who's looking to get their feet wet. I'll be out maybe $40 total. Not bad for a year or two of simple, reliable operation and learning how DCC works.
I won't feel bad putting the Bachmann system on e-bay and maybe getting $25 or $30 from someone else who's looking to get their feet wet. I'll be out maybe $40 total. Not bad for a year or two of simple, reliable operation and learning how DCC works.
