I have a 36"x66" layout with a upper level rear. The front of the layout is flat at 26"x66" the remaing 10"x66" is a step up by 4". I am using flex track on 15" radius curves. One joined run in the front of the layout and it separates into two runs on the hill. My question is what is the proper place to start the run up onto the rear hill? That is how far from the hill need I start the run up?
Correct rise to hill
- Thread starter Royalhaw
- Start date
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That requires a lot of calculation. You need to determine two things, which are your opinions, before you can determine the answer to your question.
Where does the down-slope from the back begin?
How steep of a hill are you comfortable with?
In the real world, modern main lines are never more than something like 1.5% grades. That is, they only climb 1.5" for every 100" traveled. So not very steep, and you'd be pretty miserable trying to make that fit on your layout. In HO scale it's typically comfortable to go as much as 4% (4" climb in 100") grade if you don't plan on running too long of trains. N scale is probably similar. So that sounds like you need at least 100" of inclined track between the lower and upper levels. Unless you're willing to go even steeper.
Where does the down-slope from the back begin?
How steep of a hill are you comfortable with?
In the real world, modern main lines are never more than something like 1.5% grades. That is, they only climb 1.5" for every 100" traveled. So not very steep, and you'd be pretty miserable trying to make that fit on your layout. In HO scale it's typically comfortable to go as much as 4% (4" climb in 100") grade if you don't plan on running too long of trains. N scale is probably similar. So that sounds like you need at least 100" of inclined track between the lower and upper levels. Unless you're willing to go even steeper.
jdetray
Well-Known Member
A grade is a grade no matter the scale.
As the previous post says, climbing 4" in 100" of track is a 4% grade, which is considered steep. In the model railroad world, 2% is a more reasonable grade. That requires 200" of incline to rise 4".
The steeper the grade, the fewer cars you can pull, or the more powerful engine you will need (or multiple engines). I have a 3% grade on my layout, and a small industrial switcher struggles to pull two cars up the hill. A 4-axle road loco can pull 6-7 cars up the same hill.
- Jeff
As the previous post says, climbing 4" in 100" of track is a 4% grade, which is considered steep. In the model railroad world, 2% is a more reasonable grade. That requires 200" of incline to rise 4".
The steeper the grade, the fewer cars you can pull, or the more powerful engine you will need (or multiple engines). I have a 3% grade on my layout, and a small industrial switcher struggles to pull two cars up the hill. A 4-axle road loco can pull 6-7 cars up the same hill.
- Jeff
Hmm, I guess my post was a bit misleading. Grades are indeed the same regardless of scale, as it's a ratio of rise:run. What I apparently failed to include was that 4% doesn't seem uncommon with small HO layouts because the locomotives can handle it. I don't know if the power of electric motors scales similarly with N scale on the same grades and what common grades are for small N scale layouts. The motors might actually be more powerful (for their scale), but the size of the locomotive might not provide enough mass to keep the wheels from spinning on a steep grade with the same number of cars.
And it definitely depends on the type of locomotive being used. It's my understanding that, in keeping with the real thing, model Shay locomotives can handle quite steep grades. The Bachmann On30 Shay apparently can pull a train up 6% and greater inclines, where the real world Cass Scenic Railroad has documented 8%+ inclines that their Shays navigate weekly.
Trial and error I guess. There's a balance between cramming the layout features you want into the space you have and choosing the equipment that can handle it
And it definitely depends on the type of locomotive being used. It's my understanding that, in keeping with the real thing, model Shay locomotives can handle quite steep grades. The Bachmann On30 Shay apparently can pull a train up 6% and greater inclines, where the real world Cass Scenic Railroad has documented 8%+ inclines that their Shays navigate weekly.
Trial and error I guess. There's a balance between cramming the layout features you want into the space you have and choosing the equipment that can handle it
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