Comuter Operating Systems

[Bruette]

Computer Operating Systems

Hi everyone!

I want to share some thoughts about upgrading Operating Systems.

IBM based PC's are in my opinion the best thing since sliced bread. They have change the world we live in and in many ways made our lives better.

In general terms IBM based PC's are twice as powerful and cost half as much as Apple's PC's

I began manufacturing my own private label PC's in the time when they did not even come with the operating systems installed. The end user was expected to install it or pay a premium to have it done. Now we take it out of the box, plug it in and we are up and running in a matter of minutes.

The open platform allows anyone to make a product for a PC and the product can be great, but with out the right drivers and support it can be a nightmare for the end user to set up and use.

The one problem the open platform has always had is compatibility. There have been and continue to be significant improvements in compatibility. The PC's are getting easier to use, faster and better in many other ways everyday.

When it comes to upgrading your Operating System ask yourself "do I need this to solve a problem or to perform a task?" If the answer is no then why upgrade? You will save yourself some compatibility problems if you let some else work out the bugs and compatibility issues.

I am still running Windows XP on a few systems and I have no reason to upgrade them because they serve their respective purposes. As long as Microsoft continues to support XP with updates I will not upgrade those systems.

The rest of my network is Windows 7.

If I had touch screen systems I would want Windows 8. The only significant advantage I see with Windows 8 over Windows 7 is the support of the touch screen. I can almost guarantee you that Microsoft will add service packs that changes that if they have not already done so.

I am always slow to adapt new technology unless I have a specific need or there is a significant advantage. I have enough I want to do (playing with my trains for one) with out creating work I have to do or problems to solve.

Like the old saying goes "if it isn't broke, don't fix it"

I have to add a disclaimer here: I am no longer an expert in this field as I have not kept up with the changing technology as much as I use to and I am no longer a professional in the field. My statements are in general terms from my experience. If the experts and professionals on here see that I have made a mistake please correct me. If you disagree with me let me know your thoughts.

As you can see from the title of this thread I am not as sharp as I use to be!

 

[montanan]

Like the old saying goes "if it isn't broke, don't fix it"

Is that ever the truth. I usually build my own computers. I find that I can build a better computer, make it expandable, and spend a lot less than buying one. My old one died after eight years from a hard drive going out. I am no IT person, but do have an extensive background in electronics. The old computer was still running on Windows XP. It did everything I needed it to do, so I didn't bother upgrading the operating system. I also use computers at work, and I received a new computer with Vista. What a night mare. I did upgrade it to Windows 7. I personally won't touch Windows 8 thank you very much.

Here's one interesting thing I found out recently. My new home computer has Windows 7 for an operating system, and I was using IE as one of my browsers, although I prefer FireFox. My wife had a program she uses for our bowling league. When getting ready for leagues to start, she could not start the program. After an abundance of colorful words, I called tech support for the software and found out some very interesting info. The tech asked me if we had IE, and I said yes. It seem that if IE10, which I had was automatically updated, some programs would not operate properly, or would not operate at all. This was a bit confusing, because her bowling software did not use the internet at all. He advised me to delete the IE 10 update, and everything worked fine. I also did this to all of the computers at work, and minor "bugs" were eliminated.

 

[RCShadow]

Remember the lawsuit MS was in because IE was too "embedded" with the OS? It's still true. All they did was unhook some of it to the point of fulfilling the requirements of the court case.

The .Net technologies, even desktop ones, use the assemblies (.dll's) of the IE foundation to function. These assemblies (.dll's) use the ones supplied by the installed IE version.

I have avoided the upgrade to IE10 for the reasons you mention. It's slower and causes more bugs than it fixes. If you have auto-update on and also have the box checked to get all the updates, not just critical ones, God help you. I always do updates on my personal box with the critical ones as automatic but install so I can review them. I never set them to install the optional ones automatically.

Just to let everyone know, the schedule for updates to the Windows OS's are roughly the second Tuesday of the month or "Patch Tuesday" as it's known...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patch_Tuesday

If you happen to get an update that is on a weird day of the week like Friday or Saturday, then a security problem was probably detected and an emergency patch was issued to mitigate the damage.

Now, before anyone gets into an argument about "I never get mine on Tuesday, I get them on Thursday". MS has severs all across the nation and roll-out the updates and your system listens for them. Maybe your area has not received or always gets to you later than others. After all, MS has to get to all the PC's with their OS on it and that takes time as you can imagine. This is also done in other countries but they get their own versions of these updates due to laws in place or other special considerations like that.

 

[RCShadow]

Win7 on our main home PCs. Couple of XP machines laying around and the wife has an old Mac thingie that is basically a doorstop since I built her a a machine for her home work needs (Graphic designer/ Print readiness professional). Even using my old AMD 555 and ASUS 970 mobo that machine is a rocket. It is all SSD drives. She uses a $5,000 Apple at work and the responsiveness of the relatively cheap PC (~$500) I built amazes her.

My current PC:

AMD FX-4170 OC'd to 4.9 Ghz

ASUS Sabertooth Mobo

ThermalTake PRO watercooler

16 GB Samsung Wonder RAM

2 x Corsair 120 GB SSD 1 for OS and the other for Music

1 x 256 GB Samsung SSD - Games

2 x Powercolor HD 6790 GPU's in Crossfire

Corsair K90 Keyboard

850 watt OCZ PSU

That's impressive. You are a geek. I have stayed away from water cooled setups. Too fiddly for me. I get enough of this stuff without worrying about water. I leave the chillers to the heavy stuff like mainframes .

 

[RCShadow]

I hear ya.

If you want to be really impressed, search on YouTube for the Liquid Nitrogen cooled setups. Some don't run long, but they sure run FAST. Big deal lol.

If I came across anyone with an Exotic car attending a group that liked straight lines (drag racing), I'd ask him what he is over-compensating for? If he was big, I'd say it and run lol.

 

[Motley]

What does this have to do with trains?

But I am a gamer, and I have a decent rig myself.

i7 3770k @ 4.2Ghz / Asus Z77 Sabertooth
16GB DDR3 1600 GSkill Ripjaws
Saphire HD7950 950Mhz
Cooling: Corsair H80
Crucial M4 256GB
Dell U2412M & HP LP2475W 3840x1200
Case: NZXT Switch 810
PSU: Corsair HX850
Windows 7 64bit

Windows 8 sucks. Its made for touchscreens, not desktops. They failed with this completely, and thats why Ballmer is now gone.

 

[RCShadow]

What does this have to do with trains?

But I am a gamer, and I have a decent rig myself.

i7 3770k @ 4.2Ghz / Asus Z77 Sabertooth
16GB DDR3 1600 GSkill Ripjaws
Saphire HD7950 950Mhz
Cooling: Corsair H80
Crucial M4 256GB
Dell U2412M & HP LP2475W 3840x1200
Case: NZXT Switch 810
PSU: Corsair HX850
Windows 7 64bit

I guess I would have to answer that with the computer controlled train setups?? It's still interesting what people have but then again, being a geek myself, it's interesting . You have a nice configuration .

I have to admit though, I've never been a gamer and probably never will be to be honest. The closest I come to it is Flight Simulator to keep my procedures current for IFR flight. I also run RealFlight to keep my R/C skills up to par and to work on new maneuvers without risk to my planes lol.

 

[RCShadow]

When I re-entered the MRR scene about 6 months ago I mistakenly figured that computer control of layouts was now commonplace. From the little bit of MRR information that I had from watching from afar I actually thought that DCC allowed this. I was shocked to find out that only a couple of fringe systems that require scratchbuilding all of the components allowed computer control of layout. Then after I looked into it I discovered that DCC is completely archaic and based on 70's tech and I decided to not delve into DCC. I figured if I retain interest in MRRing (appears to be so) I will go with one of the RC systems (S-Cab is currently my top choice) after my layout is complete. In anticipation of this, I am currently using a 500 watt PC PSU with a wall dimmer for my "transformer", along with an old TYCO unit to supply the AC for switch machines.

As far as "Gaming", I am not into the shooter games. My favorite of all time is actually Railroad Tycoon 3. I do like the war- based empire builder games too though, and I may just hop up my rig when Total War Rome II comes out soon.

I have to agree with you on DCC. I have been disappointed in it as well. When it works, it's great...but the bugs. I have had times where completely resetting the system fixed loco's that seem to loose thier minds. Reminds me of the old PC days when you would call tech support and the first thing out of their mouths was "did you boot?".

 

[railfan]

I went through an IT geek period and came close to getting a computer job. Was trying to switch careers after my lower back was worn out. Took a bunch of classes and built a few computers. For awhile I had two different (ISP's) internet connections at home.....to enable experiments with wide area networking. Spent many hundreds of hours on microsoft flight simulator as well.

 

[RCShadow]

I went through an IT geek period and came close to getting a computer job. Was trying to switch careers after my lower back was worn out. Took a bunch of classes and built a few computers. For awhile I had two different (ISP's) internet connections at home.....to enable experiments with wide area networking. Spent many hundreds of hours on microsoft flight simulator as well.

Well, be glad you didn't enter IT. Back when Clinton was in office, he opened the flood gates of foreign workers (H1B's) and watered down the market. Touting a shortage of STEM workers was nothing but a ploy to supress salaries. I think corporate America was not willing to pay what STEM workers are worth so to fix the issue, you bring in workers that will work for peanuts, 24x7 a day, and take the treatment of being a subservient. This in turn killed many good peoples careers. I have done somewhat ok in the fallout but my lifestyle has changed big time. I have 30 years invested so changing careers now doesn't make much sense to me at this point.

Greed. Nuff said on this sore issue to be honest. It gets my dander up and more.

 

[D&J RailRoad]

I'm using an old Toshiba Satellite laptop to run my Train Controller Silver software. It takes just a few minutes to boot up, editing the signal configurations and running the signal system, it's quite adequate. I also do professional video production. That's where my quad processor system and over a Terrabyte of storeage comes in handy for the real time rendering and final coverting the HD video to BlueRay.

 

[Bruette]

Michael,

You are one of the wisest railroaders on here and I am surprised you would ask what this has to do with trains! Like they say on ESPN "Come on man!"

Do you know any members of the forum that does not use a computer?

How many times have your read about a model railroader that wants to throw their PC out the window?

I started this to get people to think twice before they upgrade. "if it isn't broke, don't fix it"

Nice system by the way!

What does this have to do with trains?

But I am a gamer, and I have a decent rig myself.

i7 3770k @ 4.2Ghz / Asus Z77 Sabertooth
16GB DDR3 1600 GSkill Ripjaws
Saphire HD7950 950Mhz
Cooling: Corsair H80
Crucial M4 256GB
Dell U2412M & HP LP2475W 3840x1200
Case: NZXT Switch 810
PSU: Corsair HX850
Windows 7 64bit

Windows 8 sucks. Its made for touchscreens, not desktops. They failed with this completely, and thats why Ballmer is now gone.

 

[Bruette]

I am so glad to see so many model railroaders build their own PC's!!! Way to go guys! There is nothing to it but to do it!

I am not aware of the problems with IE10, I have not encountered any problems myself, yet! If I do experience a strange problem with a 3rd party software I will keep that in mind as a last resort to fix it.

I use auto update on all my systems and auto install. I even install the optional updates if they pertain to me. I guess I am not having problems because my software is mostly Microsoft and all old. I am still using Microsoft Office 2003.

Hopefully Microsoft is the same as they were when I was doing business with them and if they knew they had a problem they were quick to work to fix it.

Montanan, I am like you. I keep my computers so long I have to replace the batteries on the motherboards.

RCShadow I am with you on the liquid coolant in a computer, but Stoker's wife is pushing the system to the max with those graphics applications. I would want to give my wife all the power available to avoid wafting for her to get done with her work and I know you would too.

Stoker, SSD is probably the biggest leap in speed we have seen since Pentium first came on the seen. I have to say I have thought about buying one just to run my operating system, but then I order another train and forget about it.

I commend you Stoker for helping to keep competition alive in the CPU market. There is nothing wrong with AMD from what I have read. Although I do seem to remember that they had some issues with graphics, help me out here RCShadow. I used Cyrix CPU's in my own systems years ago. Their 386 was faster then Intel, but they were late to roll out the 486 and they did not preform as well as Intel's 486. It was hard for me to sell Cyrix even when they were faster because Intel has always had brilliant marketing.

I have to agree with you Stoker about $3000 systems, I would think the mark up on that would be about 30% gross profit when compared to most deals on computers run at about 10%-15% Your system would be in the $3000 range or more if you had bought it ready to run. The only segment of the PC market that has any profit left is the high end and there are not many suckers, whops I mean customers that buy them.

My son just bought a 3rd generation I-7 something or other a little bit ago and he got it for under $1000 with the motherboard. He loves to have the best and he needs it for those games of his. He is a good man and he has taken the inactive to learn this stuff so I don't have to keep current. I don't have time for computer technology any more, I am a busy man, I have trains to play with!

Once again you guys have taught me a few things and I thank you!

 

[RCShadow]

I am not biased to one CPU maker or another. I'd be a hypocrite because I run both AMD and Intel. I have not seen anything that kept me from doing what I want when it comes to CPU makers. But then again, most of my stuff pertains to my career and business applications.
I don't think running Flight Simulator or RealFlight makes me a gammer at all so that point is moot.

I do have a couple of solid state drives and the biggest performance increase is boot time. They are life-limited and you shouldn't defragment them to make them last. My oldest one has been in a system that I just Remote Desktop to and it has been installed for over three years now and still has no S.M.A.R.T. warnings. I use HD Tune to monitor all my hard drives. Regular drives get a defragment every night on all my systems including servers and I use Auslogics Disk Defrag for that, not the built-in Windows defrag. I turn the Windows defrag service off (disabled).

 

[Bruette]

Talking about games; Total War is my all time favorite series I like it even better then Madden or MLB the show! Yes, I love my PS3! Even though my grandson has taken it over. He has one in his room, but it is more fun for him to play with me watching.

Before I got involved with trains full time I passed the hours away with taking over the world in one total war game or another, I like them all, but I never played the samurai one.

Another good game series is Hearts of iron

Anybody know a good affordable train game?

 

[RCShadow]

Railroad Tycoon 3 is the game you want Louis. Click here to go to Hawk & Badger to have a look at what's going on with that game. I can be found over there at this same handle. Click here to go to my personal thread at H&B. RT3 can still be found at several sources, but I suggest avoiding the Steam version as it does not allow most of the great mods that have been made.

Stoker,

Can you tell me if Steam is involved with this game at all? Not railroad steam either lol. The game provider/application Steam.

 

[RCShadow]

This game is available on Steam, but I do not recommend getting that version. As an aside, the first time I heard of Steam was on the Hawk & Badger Railroad site and I thought it was somehow related to railroading and it was a while before I found out that it was a general gaming delivery (and spying) system.

Ahhh, you are aware of that. I hate anything that involves peoples privacy being invaded. Steam is a HUGE security risk. Especially since many of the development efforts on software has gone overseas...Windows included.

 

[fcwilt]

I was shocked to find out that only a couple of fringe systems that require scratchbuilding all of the components allowed computer control of layout.

Then after I looked into it I discovered that DCC is completely archaic and based on 70's tech

There are any number of mainstream DCC command stations that support computer control - nothing to build - everything off the shelf.

And DCC tech may be from the '70s but radio control is older then that. And it looks to me like S-Cab relies on normal DCC decoders.

 

[RCShadow]

Yep, I hate Steam and avoided it until the Total War games went Steam only. My Steam account is "Forcedtomakethisaccount".

Yea I don't want anything to do with Steam or any game that doesn't have the media included with my purchase. If I license the software, give me a freaking CD/DVD with the game on it. I understand you don't want it pirated, but I am NOT covering your butt at the risk of my personal information being downloaded by some dork in India or some other pissant country.

 

[RCShadow]

Yes, S-Cab uses DCC decoders, but the RC eliminates the loss of signal issues from dirty track and whatnot and having to use Auto-Reversers which are eliminated with S-Cab. The 70's tech comment was related to the DCC system being chained to computing limitations of that era when there has obviously been great leaps forward in the computing world. Which computer control of trains systems (any number of mainstream?) are you referring to?

I guess I would have to look at any protocol changes in the basic DCC communication conversation to be sold on the idea that it has made "leaps" forward. I think the hardware being faster has masked some of the problems with the protocol but the same issues exist, its just being corrected fast enough that we, as users, don't notice it as much.