Carstens Publishing and RMC

[joed2323]

Sorry for my lack of knowledge but why is model railroader doing what they do? Why dont they mix it up? This cannot be the only forum or discussion on model railroader, they have to have an idea that many of there subscribers do not like the direction that model railroader took! Are they doing this because of the lack of competition, so they feel necessary to gear the magazine towards newbies"?
I miss the 150-200 page model railroader magazine you could get in the 90s...

I personally think they should have more hands on projects that they havent published a year ago
I dont hate the magazine, i actually look forward to the new issue every month but once i get it im kinda let down.

I know im kinda off topic talking about model railroader but.it was brought up jn this thread and i would like to know why from the more experienced modelers who have been around this hobby for quite sometime now.

 

[FCL2117]

I would expect that there's no way to make money with a 200 page MR magazine each month, there's only so much advertising you can sell.

 

[jackn2mpu]

Tell me about it. These quilters make us train modelers look tame.

If you have ever attended a "Quilting" show, you know what I mean.

In many cases, in our hobby, the publisher made bad business decisions or somehow over extended, resulting in the publication's demise. It really wasn't due to lack of readers. Even as "Model Railroader" drifts off into their own virtual reality, they still have a large number of loyal readers, who overlook the current state of the magazine.

Your explanation how small publishers use outside vendors explains much about why magazines sometimes arrive late. Mishandling, by the Post Office also accounts for some of the delayed/missing issues.

Joe

Mishandling by the post office is also sometimes caused by the way some magazines are printed and distributed and a lot of that depends on whether said magazine is handled via first class or magazine rate. Magazine rate and batches of issues get bundled together on a pallet from the printer to the post office and then split up from there. First class and it goes out like any letter or bill we as individuals would send out. This also accounts for why sometimes magazines arrive looking like they've been through a blender - it's not always the local post office or letter carrier's fault - they get them that way from the distribution center. I know this because several years ago I was getting some magazines in excellent shape and others, arriving the same day, looked really bad. I went to the local post office and had a nice long talk with the branch manager and got the scoop.

 

[jackn2mpu]

Sorry for my lack of knowledge but why is model railroader doing what they do? Why dont they mix it up? This cannot be the only forum or discussion on model railroader, they have to have an idea that many of there subscribers do not like the direction that model railroader took! Are they doing this because of the lack of competition, so they feel necessary to gear the magazine towards newbies"?
I miss the 150-200 page model railroader magazine you could get in the 90s...

I personally think they should have more hands on projects that they havent published a year ago
I dont hate the magazine, i actually look forward to the new issue every month but once i get it im kinda let down.

I know im kinda off topic talking about model railroader but.it was brought up jn this thread and i would like to know why from the more experienced modelers who have been around this hobby for quite sometime now.

Model Railroader started going down the tubes when they put a toy train guy in charge many years back. The last real model train guy they had in charge was Andy Sperandeo.

As far as why MR does what they do is because they truly don't care what their subscribers think. There are many of us here who used to inhabit the forums over at MR who spoke their piece and were essentially told to like it or lump it. Their forums are one example. Years back the forums used to be easy to use, easy on the eyes and work with any browser. Then literally overnight they made some drastic changes to the garish design they have now and have had for years. All the ads and such make it look just like a digital version of the magazine which is mostly fluff and little substance. There is one good thing I have to thank the MR forums for - people there hipped me to this forum.

There used to be scratch building articles years ago in MR - anyone seen a good one lately? I doubt it.

 

[whowey]

Tell me about it. These quilters make us train modelers look tame.

If you have ever attended a "Quilting" show, you know what I mean.

In many cases, in our hobby, the publisher made bad business decisions or somehow over extended, resulting in the publication's demise. It really wasn't due to lack of readers. Even as "Model Railroader" drifts off into their own virtual reality, they still have a large number of loyal readers, who overlook the current state of the magazine.

Your explanation how small publishers use outside vendors explains much about why magazines sometimes arrive late. Mishandling, by the Post Office also accounts for some of the delayed/missing issues.

Joe

My mom is a knitter/quilter... I learned long ago to not mess with those folks. Angry folks with big needles is not my idea of fun....

Next time you are at the newsstand... take a random selection of magazines and see where those little subscription cards go to. Most go to one or two towns now. Only the very largest publishers still do their own subscription work. Even Reader's Digest outsources some of it now.

It does lead to some interesting bedfellows though. When my wife first started working in that industry she was a incoming phone agent on the adult distribution titles desk. This led her to getting a religious magazine call one moment and then a 'blue' title one the next.

 

[jackn2mpu]

Update:
After some back and forth with a fellow from Carstens/RMC I got set up with a trial digital sub and have to say I'm highly disappointed. No 'exclusive online content' like teased on their website and the only special feature I could find was being able to click on hyperlinks on a page and go to a specific website. The online version was also difficult to read - it's like they just scanned in a print version. Fuzzy and gave me a headache and I'm on a 25.5 inch color calibrated monitor on this Mac Mini I use for Photoshop, internet, and other things so it's not a slouch of a graphics system. And unlike some magazines where one has access to a digital version I can't go back and read issues in the archives earlier than my sub date. I'm talking being able to read digital issues not those that were in print before RMC went digital (although it would be nice to see those online as well).

That and some other things have really convinced me to no renew when my print issue sub expires this month. Things like not getting a renewal notice in the mail (which should have gone out even before Sandy hit); their web guy not knowing what's available as 'features' on their website; the offices in NJ only having a small handful of people - like 3 or 4; if someone is out sick or whatever they have no one to take over that person's slot; and the people that are in the NJ offices apparently don't do much work with computers because as I found out the credit card info and such I gave the person I talked to on the phone was just written down on paper and never entered into the computer even though they could check when my sub would run out. Imagine having that info laying around - you hope the cleaning people or others that shouldn't find this stuff don't. I called my credit card company and no transaction had been made from RMC/Carstens so that's good for now (fingers crossed and knocks on wood).

Getting back to the 'exclusive online content' bit I asked the person I was corresponding with (name withheld but he's on the masthead and it's not Schaumburg) about that and he said that only happened in a couple of the early digital issues and there's been nothing since. For anyone here that MIGHT have access to the early digital issues can you clue me/us into what this mythical exclusive online content was? Thanks.

I realize there are those who have no problem with RMC/Carstens and I applaud them for that. This is what I've run into and if others have I feel for you.

 

[NYW&B]

Sorry for my lack of knowledge but why is model railroader doing what they do? Why dont they mix it up? This cannot be the only forum or discussion on model railroader, they have to have an idea that many of there subscribers do not like the direction that model railroader took! Are they doing this because of the lack of competition, so they feel necessary to gear the magazine towards newbies"?
I miss the 150-200 page model railroader magazine you could get in the 90s...

I personally think they should have more hands on projects that they havent published a year ago
I dont hate the magazine, i actually look forward to the new issue every month but once i get it im kinda let down.

I know im kinda off topic talking about model railroader but.it was brought up jn this thread and i would like to know why from the more experienced modelers who have been around this hobby for quite sometime now.

Joe, yours is a multifaceted question, but a number of specific factors basically govern the current situation.

In regard to page count, this is largely a matter controlled by income from advertisers. As the digital age matured the advertisers came to realize that a small monthly ad in MR including their web address, as opposed to a former full page printed ad, saved them a great deal of money. So, less big ads, less income, less pages of content.

The dumbing-down of content arose with the drastic change over of staff about 2000 and the assigning of a tinplate/toy train enthusiast to head up MR, which they did yet again with the latest editor, plus the rise of RTR. The replacement staff itself were for the most part seemingly journalism-degreed folks with some passing interest in the hobby. Yet they were replacing the highly experienced, talented and creative model railroaders the magazine had been famous for for years. Only David Popp demonstrates any real ability as a real modeler and inventive author and he has been spun off to MR's new, extra cost, video section.

With our hobby progressively shrinking in numbers MR, like so many other publications, felt it necessary to attempt to expand its scope and appeal to the broadest audience possible. Doing so meant writing about the most basic subjects involved in the hobby and illustrating modeling techniques of such low standards that anyone could replicate them, together with pushing RTR trains that required no talent or skill on the part of the modeler. The great kitbashing and scratchbuild features of the past were felt not only beyond the new hoped for readership, but probably beyond most of the staff as well. This situation is often reflected in the truncating of instructions offered in the few remaining construction articles to appear in MR, which are sometimes so fragmentary the project can not truly be replicated correctly by the reader.

As has already been pointed out in this thread, MR accepts no criticism about itself, nor its content. As a result virtually all the accomplished hobbyists have left the MR site and it has shrunk in membership by around 50% over the past 5-7 years, populated now largely by mediocre hobbyists and dabblers. Likewise, the magazine itself is in dramatic decline, its subscription numbers falling by 90,000 since 1994. Draw your own conclusions as to where that will lead given time.

So, from my perspective, there you have pretty much the major elements governing the hows and whys of MR's current situation.

NYW&B

 

[Graham Line]

http://model-railroad-hobbyist.com/magazine/mrh-2013-01-jan

 

[jackn2mpu]

The dumbing-down of content arose with the drastic change over of staff about 2000 and the assigning of a tinplate/toy train enthusiast to head up MR, which they did yet again with the latest editor, plus the rise of RTR. The replacement staff itself were for the most part seemingly journalism-degreed folks with some passing interest in the hobby. Yet they were replacing the highly experienced, talented and creative model railroaders the magazine had been famous for for years. Only David Popp demonstrates any real ability as a real modeler and inventive author and he has been spun off to MR's new, extra cost, video section.

NYW&B

Is Tony Koester with them anymore? He was the one ray of sunshine besides Popp MR had.

 

[Boris]

Is Tony Koester with them anymore? He was the one ray of sunshine besides Popp MR had.

I really don't want to continue beating a dead horse, but in today's mail was a solicitation from Model Railroader, offering 12 issues for under $30.00.

The enclosed flyer shows a picture of a model NP 4-6-6-4, and the banner asks: "What Does Model Railroader Have that Nobody Else Does"?

When you open the flyer the inside page shouts: "This Experienced Team of EXPERTS"

You cannot make this up!

The staff is pictured and brief bios are included. The only staffer on this list that I would consider knowledgeable is Jim Hediger. Tony Koester and Dave Popp are not listed.

True arrogance from the Dream It, Plan It, Buy It, Build It crew.

BTW: there was a separate solicitation flyer for Trains, same deal, same arrogance. Business must not be doing so well. Just a thought.

Joe

 

[Oh5oh]

As a result virtually all the accomplished hobbyists have left the MR site and it has shrunk in membership by around 50% over the past 5-7 years, populated now largely by mediocre hobbyists and dabblers.

And yet I see many of the same WPF posts at both MR and here. So if all of the 'accomplished' modelers have bailed on MR, where did they go?

 

[NYW&B]

Oh5oh - A number of advanced modeling forms have arisen in recent years whose content makes what's seen on MR and many of the other more "popular" forums look like studies in Tyco or Brio trains.

Most of these sites attempt to keep a fairly low profile so as to maintain a membership with a high degree of sophistication in their modeling and the topics addressed. A few are even pretty much membership by invitation. This may sound elitist to many, but the general intent is to maintain and support traditional model railroading in an era when talent, real modeling skills and personal creativity have been largely supplanted by Ready-Built or RTR model railroading and pointless chit-chat on so many internet forums.

NYW&B

 

[Boris]

And yet I see many of the same WPF posts at both MR and here. So if all of the 'accomplished' modelers have bailed on MR, where did they go?

Your comparison is between publicly accessed forums, not the Magazines.

There is a difference. I subscribe to five free generic public internet Model Railroad forums, usually under an ID that was a job symbol I worked when I was with Conrail. If I had something to share in the WPF threads, I would cross post.

The OP's issue and this threads discussion primarily concern the health and content of the two remaining general circulation magazines related to our hobby.

I don't consider my self an "accomplished" modeler, but an "experienced" - "close enough" - modeler. A magazine published by self annointed "experts" and aimed at "beginners" or novices no longer interests me. The magazine that contains articles I may be interested in is a small house publication, with an unreliable delivery schedule. So I am reluctant to subscribe to it.

There are additional special interest forums and groups populated by modelers who take their hobby to a more serious level than I do, which is why I dropped out of many of the ones I used to belong to. However, forum participation has little to do with the content of a magazine.

Joe

 

[Boris]

........

This may sound elitist to many, but the general intent is to maintain and support traditional model railroading in an era when talent, real modeling skills and personal creativity have been largely supplanted by Ready-Built or RTR model railroading and pointless chit-chat on so many internet forums.

NYW&B

Not at all elitist, but targeted. Getting back to my favorite whipping post, MR magazine, over the years they have evolved into a targeted "entry level" publication, hence the excessive use of the word "expert" to describe their editorial staff.

RMC targets a broader spectrum of modelers, sometimes very well, and sometimes not so well. There are also O Scale and "Hi-rail" publications which target that market, "Collectors" publications, "Fan" publications and specific N scale publications which target N scale modelers. Many offer parallel on line forums.

"Advanced" and "Experienced" modelers, are largely in HO, because it is the "right" size for building and operating fine scale details. The magazine that targeted this group ceased publication quite a while ago. Since then targeted e-zines usually published by Historical societies have filled a void for specific prototype modelers. The parallel forums you speak of, also target this type of advanced modeler, many of whom have no interest in operating more than a test track, but do fantastic work modeling specific cars, locomotives or structures.

We are truly a diverse group and are fortunate to have a choice.

Joe

 

[jackn2mpu]

Not at all elitist, but targeted. Getting back to my favorite whipping post, MR magazine, over the years they have evolved into a targeted "entry level" publication, hence the excessive use of the word "expert" to describe their editorial staff.

Joe

Since MR uses the term 'expert' to describe their editorial staff one has to ask how many NMRA Master Modelers they have on staff? Let me pull a Kreskin (Google that one) and say the number is zero.

 

[Oh5oh]

The parallel forums you speak of, also target this type of advanced modeler, many of whom have no interest in operating more than a test track, but do fantastic work modeling specific cars, locomotives or structures.

How, then, does one go about finding such groups? Not even to become a contributing member, but just to broaden one's knowledge base and learn new approaches, and even just admire the work of highly capable modelers.

 

[Burlington Bob]

By jackn2mpu;

Let me pull a Kreskin (Google that one) and say the number is zero.

If I don't have to Google Kreskin, does that mean I getting older?

 

[jackn2mpu]

By jackn2mpu;

If I don't have to Google Kreskin, does that mean I getting older?

It definitely shows your age. I doubt if any of the current generation knows about him. Remember seeing him on TV decades ago. Then again I remember Groucho on You Bet Your Life.

 

[Burlington Bob]

I don't remember Groucho on You Bet Your Life. Feeling younger already!!

 

[Boris]

How, then, does one go about finding such groups? Not even to become a contributing member, but just to broaden one's knowledge base and learn new approaches, and even just admire the work of highly capable modelers.

If you have a favorite railroad, chances are, it has a Historical Society. That's a start. Most Historical societies have decent or better web sites. Generally, they have a "links' page that connects to affinity (railroad related) web sites, including discussion groups.

Google the railroad, if you are patient, you will find many interesting facts.

Many of the groups are on Yahoo.

Joe